BEMER

Please share your experiences, successes, and failures in using non-drug therapies for RLS/WED (methods of relief that don't involve swallowing or injecting anything), including compression, heat, light, stretches, acupuncture, etc. Also under this heading, medical interventions that don't involve the administration of a medicine to the body (eg. varicose-vein operations, deep-brain stimulation). [This forum contains Topics started prior to 2009 that deal with Non-prescription Medicines, Supplements, & Diet.]
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ViewsAskew
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BEMER

Post by ViewsAskew »

So....a friend in my book club PMed me last month after I mentioned fibro. She said she had this machine and it helped pain and if I came over, she'd let me try it. Here is a link about it: https://deutschland.bemergroup.com/en

Short hand is BEMER - it used magnetic fields to increase blood flow. I took my husband and we both had a session. She said some people feel better with one session, while others it can take many sessions. Some of what she explained sounded very Woo-Woo.

Recently, either the results of the infusion are wearing off, disease has progressed, other meds have increased symptoms, or I augmented. No idea which, but the doc had me try an AD for the fibro and I used another medication for bladder urges that can make RLS worse, so I stopped both medications. It still seemed worse, so I switched to Neupro, which absolutely made it worse (that seems to happen when I augment - switching to other DAs never has helped). That seemed worrisome as I now had the increased intensity that - for me at least - is associated with augmentation.

I next stopped the Neupro a few days ago and was using only methadone. I had three rough nights - the first one I had almost no sleep. The next two I had some sleep, but not much. The next day, yesterday, I went to my friend's house to try the BEMER, as we had this scheduled. I was worried that I would be relaxed and would have symptoms, but I did not.

Last night was night 4 after stopping the Neupro. I took 5 mg less methadone than I had the two nights previously by accident. By midnight, I was in bed and sleeping (the first night I didn't sleep at all until 8 AM, the next two nights I got some sleep at 5 AM). I slept until 10 AM with only two awakenings. That is unheard of in the best of times, let alone after stopping a DA in what I am relatively sure was augmentation.

For some people, augmentation does improve in 3-4 days. And, it might have as I caught it early and immediately stopped the DA. But, then I started thinking about the BEMER and the claim that it increases blood flow and the research regarding the peripheral hypoxia. What if the BEMER increases oxygen?

I have no idea and the mat and equipment cost about US $5,000. I think you can get a refurbished one (who knows from whom) on ebay for only $3800, lol. I imagine my friend would let me come over regularly for awhile, but it isn't that close and would be difficult to do, I imagine.

If anyone gets the chance, might be worth it.
Ann - Take what you need, leave the rest

Managing Your RLS

Opinions presented by Discussion Board Moderators are personal in nature and do not, in any way, represent the opinion of the RLS Foundation, and are not medical advice.

ViewsAskew
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Re: BEMER

Post by ViewsAskew »

And, just found this:

http://www.bemer3000review.com/
Ann - Take what you need, leave the rest

Managing Your RLS

Opinions presented by Discussion Board Moderators are personal in nature and do not, in any way, represent the opinion of the RLS Foundation, and are not medical advice.

Polar Bear
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Re: BEMER

Post by Polar Bear »

Ann, I'm sorry that augmentation seems to have hit you and hope your actions have nipped it in the bud. It would be great to try your friend's machine a few times. I see on your link that there is a rental program to try before you buy.
Betty
https://www.mayoclinicproceedings.org/a ... 0/fulltext
Opinions presented by Discussion Board Moderators are personal in nature and do not, in any way, represent the opinion of the RLS Foundation

ViewsAskew
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Location: Los Angeles

Re: BEMER

Post by ViewsAskew »

There is a rental program - very expensive. BUT...if it did work, my guess is that most of us would do just about anything to find/save the money if it actually worked.

My RLS was nasty again last night - consistent with the day before I used the machine. My husband, and engineer and true skeptic of all claims, grilled me on what was different between the days. I honestly cannot think of anything. But, we also know RLS is variable AND that our experience of it is affected tremendously by placebo effect.

If it helped, it was definitely only for that day or for, say, 24 hours after. When I awakened, I could have gone back to sleep. And, I had no symptoms during the day. Today, as typical, the RLS was less intrusive in the early morning (was able to get to sleep around 6 AM), but was awakened several times with RLS and only had 3-4 hours total, at which point I HAD to get up. Now, at 3 PM, I am winding, twirling, and flexing my feet/legs as I type this. Yesterday was definitely different.

It was almost as if I had taken extra medication. And, I cannot say for sure I did not. We stayed at my friend's house until around 4 PM and then we did some shopping and went out to eat. I took my meds from the supply in my purse. At home, I have them counted out for the day in a container. When I am out, I rely on my memory to take them from a catch-all med container - split in two doses. Could I have taken an extra 5 mg of methadone at one of my doses? Maybe. But, I don't think so as husband was watching me when I counted them and remarked, "You take THAT many????" I recounted and said that I did indeed take that many. (He worries about methadone because no matter how often I explain that the dose is low COMPARED to, say, a heroin addict. He also sees I take more than one tablet, which is what most of us take for various ailments, so it seems like a LOT.)

My friend emailed me yesterday and said she hoped I would be able to try it more frequently/regularly to see if it works. I said I absolutely would given I can get there when she is available.

If I try it multiple times and get the same reaction every time, I still am not sure I would buy this. Based on the second link, this is a type of PEMF machine - used in physical therapy offices regularly. There are very cheap versions for as low as a few hundred dollars. I imagine that I'd have to to a lot of research, but could find one for no more than one to two thousand (still VERY expensive for many of us). If I could reduce medication and doctors visits, I could justify it from a cost perspective. And, from an emotional perspective? Easy case to make! Of course, we have to see if it works, first!

I did find this study that seems to show - in rats' brains - that PEMF DOES increase oxygenation in muscle tissue. https://thejns.org/view/journals/j-neur ... -p1239.xml And, in other studies, PEMF does show a protective effect on hypoxia and inflammation damage (from ischemic events). Not the same thing as what we have going on...but makes me wonder if it, for a specfic time after using it, would increase oxygenation and reduce the hypoxia much as pramipexole did in the one research study.
Ann - Take what you need, leave the rest

Managing Your RLS

Opinions presented by Discussion Board Moderators are personal in nature and do not, in any way, represent the opinion of the RLS Foundation, and are not medical advice.

ViewsAskew
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Posts: 16570
Joined: Thu Oct 28, 2004 6:37 am
Location: Los Angeles

Re: BEMER

Post by ViewsAskew »

Had my second session yesterday. My first session was in the mid afternoon. This one was at 8 PM. I was WAY awake afterward - am not blaming the session, just noting it - and didn't get to sleep until 3 AM. Was awakened at around 5 with strong RLS. Got up, wandered, etc., then sat on the couch to get rid of Pokemon and woke up at 8 AM when hubby came out to start work. Phone was laying on my stomach.

Went back to the bedroom and slept on and off for a few hours. Definitely not a great night, but also not a horrible one. Certainly can say that if the BEMER did anything, the results are not consistent or that other factors are involved.

She originally approached me regarding the fibro pain; I did notice that I had very little pain today when awakening (that is when it is worst). Again, who knows if related or not. This is why it is SO HARD to determine if anything helps. So many factors uncontrolled, so hard to account for it all.

I have meetings the next two evenings and not able to go over to her house again until the end of the week.
Ann - Take what you need, leave the rest

Managing Your RLS

Opinions presented by Discussion Board Moderators are personal in nature and do not, in any way, represent the opinion of the RLS Foundation, and are not medical advice.

Polar Bear
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Re: BEMER

Post by Polar Bear »

So confusing, ifs, buts, maybes, whys and wherefores.
It leaves us in a spin.
But everything and anything is worth a try.
Betty
https://www.mayoclinicproceedings.org/a ... 0/fulltext
Opinions presented by Discussion Board Moderators are personal in nature and do not, in any way, represent the opinion of the RLS Foundation

ViewsAskew
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Posts: 16570
Joined: Thu Oct 28, 2004 6:37 am
Location: Los Angeles

Re: BEMER

Post by ViewsAskew »

Polar Bear wrote:So confusing, ifs, buts, maybes, whys and wherefores.
It leaves us in a spin.
But everything and anything is worth a try.
It is definitely complex...and it is so hard to know what really helps and what doesn't.

I think I have another session tomorrow. We will see! For now, these are free as my friend is planning on building a business with this when she retires next year. She is sort of determined to evangelize it to the world because she feels it changed her life. It may never help me. It may never help anyone! There just isn't a lot of info, yet.
Ann - Take what you need, leave the rest

Managing Your RLS

Opinions presented by Discussion Board Moderators are personal in nature and do not, in any way, represent the opinion of the RLS Foundation, and are not medical advice.

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