99.9% copper bracelets

Please share your experiences, successes, and failures in using non-drug therapies for RLS/WED (methods of relief that don't involve swallowing or injecting anything), including compression, heat, light, stretches, acupuncture, etc. Also under this heading, medical interventions that don't involve the administration of a medicine to the body (eg. varicose-vein operations, deep-brain stimulation). [This forum contains Topics started prior to 2009 that deal with Non-prescription Medicines, Supplements, & Diet.]
Polar Bear
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99.9% copper bracelets

Postby Polar Bear » Fri Dec 18, 2015 9:29 am

I am sceptical about claims to help RLS/WED.
This advertising caught my eye, Halcyon Bracelets - two 99.9% copper bracelets, both to be worn at once, evening or all night, but not for 24 hours.
The seller is UK based and offers full refund if there is no benefit after 4 weeks although it is claimed they will work 'immediately'. They cost £19.99.

QUOTE FROM WEB SITE:
Travelling for any length of time or going to the theatre was also a nightmare before I came accross them. I have modified the bracelets, now called Halcyon Bracelets, The bracelets contain 99.9% pure copper which has been used as a natural remedy for many ailments for centuries and they are nickel free, so they are perfectly natural. I have tried other types of copper bracelets over the years (when perhaps I've forgotten them when going away) but no others have ever suited me as well as the ones I first came across all those years ago.



REVIEW FROM DR. PATRICK J HOGAN DO (WHICH IS ON THE WEB SITE)
“I am a neurologist who works with movement disorders which include Restless Legs Syndrome. I became aware of Halcyon Bracelets through the leader of our local RLS support group. He has suffered a great deal from RLS despite all state of the art medical therapies and alternative therapies. However, since wearing Halcyon Bracelets alongside his medication, he has had a very good response which has allowed him to rest peacefully. I also ordered a pair for my wife who has intermittent RLS before recommending them to anyone else. Having used them on her RLS nights, she also had quite impressive positive benefits. I have since recommended them to a number of people with RLS who have not had adequate response to medication, or would prefer to use something without a systemic medication effect. Although the mechanism of action of Halcyon Bracelets on RLS can only be speculation at this stage, it is certainly not harmful and obviously has vastly less cost and side effects than adding additional medications. I do not expect them to be a cure for RLS, as there is not yet a cure, or to negate the need for medication for some sufferers, but they are a very useful additional tool to have for people who suffer the agony of RLS.”

Dr Patrick J Hogan DO Neurologist
Tacoma, Washington USA


My head tells me that any benefit gained from these would only be by someone deficient in copper.
If there was a chance that they would benefit RLS/WED and/or arthritis I'd have them in a heartbeat and surely everyone would be wearing them.
I've half a mind to order them for 'research purposed' as a refund would be possible.
Yes, I know - I've tried all sorts of oils and supplements before without any benefit and take such claims with a pinch of salt.

A search on our discussion board hasn't brought up anything on Halcyon Bracelets - has anyone got an opinion or comment on copper bracelets in general and the claims of Halcyon Bracelets in particular.
Betty
http://www.willis-ekbom.org/about-rls-wed/publications
Opinions presented by Discussion Board Moderators are personal in nature and do not, in any way, represent the opinion of the RLS Foundation

Yankiwi
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Re: 99.9% copper bracelets

Postby Yankiwi » Sat Dec 19, 2015 8:34 am

I'm skeptical too, but I'm a natural skeptic. Copper bracelets have been touted as providing relief from arthritis as far back as ancient Greece. I guess they had snake oil salesmen too. Double blind trials have shown that copper bracelets don't help arthritis so why should they help RLS? I know they are different ailments but I think the sellers of Halcyon Bracelets have just found a new target market.
Severe RLS is enough to prompt many of us to try almost anything and I think that is what marketers of dubious products count on. About the only thing a copper bracelet is guaranteed to do is turn your wrist green.

Polar Bear
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Re: 99.9% copper bracelets

Postby Polar Bear » Sat Dec 19, 2015 6:27 pm

I so agree with what you say and a green wrist is just about guarranteed .... and yet there's a little part of me that will try anything... the oils, the soap under the bed... none of them did anything for me even as a temporary placebo, snake oils indeed.
Desperation will prompt many sufferers of various chronic condiions to try anything. To read to comments on the Halcyon Face Book page makes them tempting to try, with the money back guarrantee.

Hmmm. do I or don't I ??
My brain is saying - Would you ever wise up and have a bit of sense !!
I might tell myself it's a research mission.
I will have a chat with myself :) :)
Betty
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badnights
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Re: 99.9% copper bracelets

Postby badnights » Mon Dec 21, 2015 8:23 am

They don't contain nickel therefore they're natural? Ouch. Copper and nickel are both naturally occurring metals.

Apparently copper can actually be absorbed slowly through the skin .... the journal sounds legit but I didn't investigate further - from an article in the American Journal of Nutrition (http://ajcn.nutrition.org/content/63/5/797S.1.full.pdf):
In general, copper does
not enter vertebrates through the skin, unless, for example, it is
applied in high concentrations in the form of specific ointments or if copper bracelets are worn ( 1 , 8, 9). Only microgram
amounts of copper per day are thought to be absorbed by this
route under optimal conditions, but this absorption can become
significant. Walker (9) reported that up to 13 mg can be
delivered per month, and that this happens through the formation
of glycine-copper complexes dissolved in sweat.

I wonder if there's also iron in the copper bracelets that is getting absorbed, and the benefit people see is because of the iron? That would mean they're lying about the 99%, of course.

We should see if there's a dermal delivery method for iron - - like iron bracelets or something. It might provide more consistent absorption than our guts for some of us.
Beth - Wishing you all restful sleep tonight
WED/RLS AUGMENTATION:
viewtopic.php?f=5&t=6532&p=61601#p61601
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Rustsmith
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Re: 99.9% copper bracelets

Postby Rustsmith » Mon Dec 21, 2015 10:13 am

I can't believe that a topic on this board has moved into my profession a metallurgist.

There is such a thing as pure copper that forms in nature. However, deposits of natural wire copper are so rare that it is not possible that these bracelets were made from anything other than the same purified copper that is used to make electrical wire. So, your definition of "natural" will determine whether these bracelets are or are not. The copper originally came from "natural" copper ore, but has been through a lot of processing in order to become a copper bracelet. If you use that logic to define natural, then everything you come into contact with is natural.

Badnights, it is theoretically possible for there to be up to 2% iron dissolved in copper. So, part of the 0.1% of the bracelet that isn't copper could contain some iron. As for an iron bracelet, this would probably need to be a low carbon steel, which would be very easy to obtain and make. The steel could not be any form of stainless steel for your idea to work, which means the bracelet would either be gray or black. Your arm would also start to turn orange instead of green and the chances of staining other things (like clothing) orange would be a lot greater then transferring green stain from the copper.
Steve

Augmentation Evaluation http://bb.rls.org/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=9005

Opinions presented by Discussion Board Moderators are personal in nature and do not, in any way, represent the opinion of the RLS Foundation, and are not medical advice.

Polar Bear
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Re: 99.9% copper bracelets

Postby Polar Bear » Mon Dec 21, 2015 12:36 pm

Thank you, Beth and Steve.
I am always happy to see relevant information written that can be easily understood.
Betty
http://www.willis-ekbom.org/about-rls-wed/publications
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badnights
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Re: 99.9% copper bracelets

Postby badnights » Mon Dec 28, 2015 3:44 am

Native copper (meaning elemental copper, copper metal, not bound with other substances in a molecular compound) is not really rare, though it's not common either. It's way way more common than native gold, for example. Nickel, on the other hand, is quite rare in native form since it reacts with oxygen so readily. But I'm sure the writer wasn't aware of this, and didn't consider what exactly he/she meant by "natural". The statement that disturbed me was " The bracelets contain 99.9% pure copper which has been used as a natural remedy for many ailments for centuries and they are nickel free, so they are perfectly natural." This is a clear implication that nickel is "unnatural", or actually that nickel alloyed with copper is unnatural and bad. You're right, Steve, we could draw the line anywhere, and it's just semantics.

I don't think the amount of iron that could be absorbed through the skin from a 0.1% iron bracelet would be clinically significant... but then, I expected to learn that copper couldn't be absorbed through the skin at all, when I looked into it, and I quickly found out I was wrong. So maybe the reported improvements are due to iron absorption. Or, as Betty suggests, a pre-existing copper deficiency that somehow promotes RLS/WED.
Beth - Wishing you all restful sleep tonight
WED/RLS AUGMENTATION:
viewtopic.php?f=5&t=6532&p=61601#p61601
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Rustsmith
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Re: 99.9% copper bracelets

Postby Rustsmith » Mon Dec 28, 2015 9:57 am

Thank you Beth, I guessed that my statement might get a response out of you. My point on rarity is that it is not common enough that there are any native copper mines. Native wire copper exists, but not in large enough quantities to create enough bracelets to market them at affordable prices.
Steve

Augmentation Evaluation http://bb.rls.org/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=9005

Opinions presented by Discussion Board Moderators are personal in nature and do not, in any way, represent the opinion of the RLS Foundation, and are not medical advice.

martino
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Re: 99.9% copper bracelets

Postby martino » Sun Mar 20, 2016 3:53 pm

I only joined a couple of days ago and have just read about the Halcyon bracelets. I have been using them since last Tuesday totally in accordance with the instructions. I suffer daily with RLS and it is fair to say that so far any benefit has been, at best, negligible. By this I mean that the pain , which continues, just might have been less severe if I didn't have the bracelets. It is possible that if the RLS is mild the RLS symptoms might appear lessened by wearing them. I started out a sceptic but my granddaughter (aged 12) said that if I didn't try them I wouldn't know whether they worked

Polar Bear
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Re: 99.9% copper bracelets

Postby Polar Bear » Mon Mar 21, 2016 11:04 am

martino - I am in exactly the same position as yourself.

These things rarely work. If they did work wouldn't we all be running around in copper bracelets - albeit Halcyon states that their copper is quite RLS specific.

Yes, I sent for them, No, I can't say there was any benefit after several weeks.
And yet, idiot that I am, I sometimes put them on just in case there might be a little placebo affect.

I should have known better, but reckoned I had nothing to lose..... well.... except £20.
Betty
http://www.willis-ekbom.org/about-rls-wed/publications
Opinions presented by Discussion Board Moderators are personal in nature and do not, in any way, represent the opinion of the RLS Foundation

martino
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Re: 99.9% copper bracelets

Postby martino » Mon Mar 21, 2016 8:04 pm

Thanks for your comments. That is about where I am! Wearing them I wonder how bad the RLS would be without them. A bit insidious isn't it?

Polar Bear
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Re: 99.9% copper bracelets

Postby Polar Bear » Tue Mar 22, 2016 11:08 am

Last night was my best for a long time, I slept from 1am until 6.30 am, which is almost never ever happens, albeit I had a little extra sleeping aid.
And I wasn't wearing any copper bracelets.
Betty
http://www.willis-ekbom.org/about-rls-wed/publications
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