Do you take any of these meds?

Anything on your mind that isn't about RLS/WED? It's nice to realize that there is life beyond this disease and have an opportunity to get to know our online family in a different context.
ViewsAskew
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Do you take any of these meds?

Postby ViewsAskew » Wed Jan 28, 2015 2:39 am

A recent study came out and found some correlation between medications taken and later dementia risk. I thought it important to share.

http://news.yahoo.com/widely-used-drugs ... 40600.html
Ann - Take what you need, leave the rest

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Re: Do you take any of these meds?

Postby Rustsmith » Wed Jan 28, 2015 8:48 am

The article was interesting enough that I looked up Dr. Gray's paper that was being summarized. I came away with a slightly different understanding of what she said as compared to the Yahoo article.

For example, I became really interested when Yahoo cited the antihistamine Chlor-Trimeton. I started taking this drug when I was four and took it for many years. Dr Gray's paper does not even mention Chlor-Trimeton, but does talk about Bendryl as a possble issue. However, she goes on to say that the second generation antihistamines should not be a problem, which is quite a bit different from the general impression created by Yahoo.

Further, the paper discusses opioids and other analgesics as a class of drug that can lead to cognitive issues in the elderly but also admit that the underlying pain that they treat is a greater problem. Then the paper fails to mention any drugs specifically other than meperidine. As for the other analgesics that it cites, seems that in this area they were high dose to overdose of NSAIDs such as acetaminophen.

I therefore found the paper to be rather enlightening but also disturbing in absence of information from past studies for the elderly and the long term effects of many of the drugs that we take.
Steve

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Re: Do you take any of these meds?

Postby ViewsAskew » Wed Jan 28, 2015 7:13 pm

I really hate when news outlets do that. It reminds me of the case that went to court because Fox News wanted the reporters to essentially lie. The reporters lost. Too many places do NOT have any journalistic integrity.

Thank you for pointing out the differences!
Ann - Take what you need, leave the rest



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Re: Do you take any of these meds?

Postby Rustsmith » Wed Jan 28, 2015 9:52 pm

I have been involved in several situations that were covered by the press. That includes at least three different situations covered by the national mainstream media plus one that was an "expose" of my employer by a journalist of note. In each case, the story was crafted by writer to make some sort of point rather than just gathering and reporting the facts. Everyone wants to be the first with a story or to do a muckraking expose rather than emulate the old time television journalists like Walter Cronkite, David Huntley or Chet Brinkley.

Unfortunately, most people these days do not get to see how a variety of slants are injected into the "news" simply by not mentioning a couple of key facts or through the selection of words that imply something that is not always supported by the facts. Many people hate Fox, but I find the rest of the media to be just as biased in their reporting but they just do it with more finesse and are much more subtle about it.

As a case in point, how many times following the flooding of New Orleans by Hurricane Katrina have you heard stories about how no one expected the levee failure to happen. Well "no one" must not include anyone who has lived in New Orleans for very long. We all knew that the worst case scenario for the city was a level 4 or 5 hurricane that hit exactly where Katrina did. The local weathermen covered this every summer as the heart of the hurricane season approached. The location where Katrina hit forced lots of water into Lake Pontchartrain and then the backside winds of the storm would push the extra tides up and over the lakeside levees. We also all knew that the design storm for the older parts of the lakeside levees was a level 3 storm! Katrina at the time was classified as a level 4, but changes made because of Katrina would today have placed the storm as a level 4 for winds and a level 5 for flooding. For those not familiar with the scales for hurricanes, there is no level 6 and a minimal level 1 storm packs steady 75 mph winds.

Everyone in Louisiana also knows that any government funded contract in the state in past years was rife with kickbacks, bribes, etc. This was just an expected a way of life in south Louisiana up until about 10 or so years back. So my reaction when I saw that the eye had passed, was headed away and the city streets were not flooded was that they had survived a near miss. I was also quite sad, but not surprised when I saw the news that evening (6 hrs later) and the levee had just given way.

So here is a national story repeated by the press over the years and not once have I heard any of the details that reflect that anyone who has been through hurricane season there is aware of. Why, the most innocent reason is that they wanted to tell a story that did not reflect badly on the city. I won't say what I really think was the reason.
Steve

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Opinions presented by Discussion Board Moderators are personal in nature and do not, in any way, represent the opinion of the RLS Foundation, and are not medical advice.

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Re: Do you take any of these meds?

Postby ViewsAskew » Wed Jan 28, 2015 10:07 pm

As I try to figure out what to do now that consulting (the way I have) is no longer in the cards, I've been thinking of ideas. One is to have a True News site - just the facts. As part of it, there would be talking points related to perspectives - from the left, blah blah, from the right, blah blah, from the environmentalists, blah blah.

To me, I think a LOT of people have no idea that anything comes with a bias. They believe that news organizations are supposed to tell the truth. The case I mentioned is crucial because it exposed that they are not, yet many people truly do not understand. And, when you include our own tendency for confirmation bias, we have little to no reason to question what is said.

I didn't use to do this (and I didn't above at all), but when I read something, I now try to read about it from multiple sources. Eventually I get to pick out what really happened, what really is at stake, etc. Hence my idea for the True News (or whatever I'd call it). It's time consuming to have to do so you have to be dedicated to figuring it out and you have to be good at searching - something not all of of can do based on how we live our lives.
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Re: Do you take any of these meds?

Postby Rustsmith » Wed Jan 28, 2015 10:51 pm

Sometimes it is not so much a matter of truth as it is one of perspective. Simply a case of half full or half empty.

A case in point, there was a major gas pipeline explosion outside of San Francisco a few years ago. It was a terrible tragedy that killed 8, leveled 38 homes and damaged another 200. I had the opportunity to read through the failure investigation conducted by the NTSB. The NTSB is only allowed to report the facts of their investigation. They do not draw any conclusions even though one or more conclusions is often highly obvious.

In this particular case, a lay person like a reporter or a politician could read the report and come to the conclusion that the pipeline owner had been negligent in a number of areas. When I read the report, I came to the conclusion that the company had been exceedingly lucky that this 50 yr old pipeline had not failed MANY years ago, including year 1 of its life. The pipe that was installed was so exceedingly defective that it should have been obvious to both the manufacturer and the construction company that this was just plain wrong. However, both of those companies have long since gone out of business so blaming them isn't going anywhere.

So the reporter or politician sees all the damage and a report about a section of defective pipe and immediately blames the pipeline's owner. I see a piece of pipe that was so obviously defective from day one that it should never have been installed. The fault in my eyes is not the owner but the company that was contracted to build the pipe. I think that the company was very "lucky" that the pipe lasted as long as it did.

So, now this has triggered talk in Congress to require an expensive form of inspection for ALL pipelines, but current inspection technology would not have detected this particular problem. There are even a few politicians that are starting to advocate that all of these older pipelines should be replaced, which also is not necessary since many today are as good as they were new. Finally, most pipeline companies are essentially utilities. They are allowed to make a small return by charging fees to transport oil or gas from A to B for a client. As such, requiring them to perform needless inspections or even to replace good pipe that is older than a specified age is only going to result in the company adding these costs to the fees that are eventually passed on as costs to the consumer.

In the spirit of truth and full disclosure, the transportation pipeline companies have been clients of mine in the past and I currently own stock in a number of them. I am also currently working as an expert witness against one of them, so I have no particular axe to grind in this battle.
Steve

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Opinions presented by Discussion Board Moderators are personal in nature and do not, in any way, represent the opinion of the RLS Foundation, and are not medical advice.

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Re: Do you take any of these meds?

Postby ViewsAskew » Thu Jan 29, 2015 12:12 am

I don't think that is perspective, Steve. Those are facts. A reporter should ask the question - was this ever OK? They should interview someone adept at reading the report and report on how the report is interpreted by an expert, something the reporter cannot do. I often hear reporters called on to be "experts" about things. They may become well-versed in something after years of coverage, but they cannot replace someone like you in this situation.
Ann - Take what you need, leave the rest



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Re: Do you take any of these meds?

Postby jul2873 » Thu Jan 29, 2015 3:18 am

I am really seeing slanted news in the coverage of kratom. It's unbelievable. I've seen news stories calling it the new bath salts, even the new heroin. The reality is that there isn't one death that can be traced to kratom as the responsible drug. Not one, when six people die every day from alcohol related causes.

I'm not sure if it's just slopping reporting, or if there is an agenda. I don't think that until the internet we hadany idea how sloppy/slanted the news was.

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Re: Do you take any of these meds?

Postby ViewsAskew » Thu Jan 29, 2015 7:18 am

I only hope that more people start seeing that slant. I have a feeling if we read things from 1700 to 1950, we'd find that they weren't nearly as objective as we think.

Years ago, we were more homogeneous - things that didn't fall into the norms were more hidden. The vast majority went to church, women usually dressed conservatively, and so on. When an article wrote about how horrible a drug was or being non-religious or being gay or history being rewritten....or whatever....it was pretty much accepted. I don't think folks realized about whatever agenda was being put forth because they had similar world views - so you didn't see it. As we've started to accept that we aren't so homogenous, we start to come up against the status quo that was accepted and start to question it.

Maybe this is a period we're going through to get to someplace where we really do find some sort of true objectivity along with honesty about our assumptions and where we are coming from.
Ann - Take what you need, leave the rest



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Re: Do you take any of these meds?

Postby Rustsmith » Thu Jan 29, 2015 9:18 am

Ann, in looking at this issue from a very broad perspective I agree with you. However, it changes a bit when you get into the details. The primary question is "Who vets the expert"? You can look at many lawsuits today and find a situation of dueling expert opinions. The case will have two experts looking at the same set of facts and coming to completely different opinions. In some of these situations you will find that one of the experts falls into what I categorize as an "opinion for hire", someone who will testify to whatever conclusion is needed. However, this is frequently not the case. For these situations, I would reference the discussion lately on EeFall's topic where I talked about how doctors will often look at the facts and only see the situation that fits within their own specialty and how this frequently leads to an incorrect diagnosis. In this case, it is up to the patient (or his/her advocate) to decide which doctor/expert to believe.
Steve

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Opinions presented by Discussion Board Moderators are personal in nature and do not, in any way, represent the opinion of the RLS Foundation, and are not medical advice.

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Re: Do you take any of these meds?

Postby ViewsAskew » Thu Jan 29, 2015 9:06 pm

You are right, Steve. No easy answer to most things, is there?

There are a few people - rare though they are - that can hold two opposing views and see the merits and problems with each. We need more of them in such positions. Many times - legal cases notwithstanding - it's about being simply informed of all perspectives and taking the approach that seems to be the best for the people/situation. There isn't such as thing, in many cases, of being "right."
Ann - Take what you need, leave the rest



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Re: Do you take any of these meds?

Postby Rustsmith » Thu Jan 29, 2015 10:13 pm

Ann, amazing how far off topic that we have drifted. Good thing this is in the No WED forum.

One last thought is that most of the time we do not have all of the facts. I deal with both the engineering and science side of my specialty, I can say that the different is that engineers are expected to come up with a workable solution even in the absence of as much information was they might desire. In other words, we make do and try to get close even if that requires an educated guess. Scientists on the other hand deal in absolutes. In many situations, they will study something for years trying to eek out the most subtle of details in order to find a complete answer.

Unfortunately, I think that our present day, electronic society wants "scientific" answers with an engineering timeframe and we have not come up to grips yet with what all engineers know, which is sometimes we guess wrong.
Steve

Augmentation Evaluation http://bb.rls.org/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=9005

Opinions presented by Discussion Board Moderators are personal in nature and do not, in any way, represent the opinion of the RLS Foundation, and are not medical advice.

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Re: Do you take any of these meds?

Postby ViewsAskew » Fri Jan 30, 2015 2:38 am

I thought the same - that it was good we were in this forum :-)

I work on the human side - applying scientific findings about work, the workplace, systems, etc. to create better outcomes within companies (higher sales, less waste, better decision making, etc.). We never can know because there are many too many components in the system. We make best guesses based on what we do know and where we're trying to go. Then we wait and see. I find that, as you noted, many of the people I work for want absolutes in areas where there are none. People and systems just do not work that way!
Ann - Take what you need, leave the rest



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Re: Do you take any of these meds?

Postby sleepdancer2 » Fri Jan 30, 2015 4:17 am

Let me just say how refreshing it is to read mature civilized discussion on topics that can be debatable without it deteriorating into personal attacks and angry tirades. Not all forums accomplish this. As to the news, at this point in life I expect all "news" to be slanted and incomplete, to say the least, and want a number of sources from which to draw my own conclusions.
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Re: Do you take any of these meds?

Postby Rustsmith » Fri Jan 30, 2015 9:10 am

Thank you sleepdancer. As the saying goes, it takes all kinds to make this world go round. If only people, and especially our politicians, realized that and would use it work together.
Steve

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Opinions presented by Discussion Board Moderators are personal in nature and do not, in any way, represent the opinion of the RLS Foundation, and are not medical advice.


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