Restless Legs Syndrome (RLS) Discussion Board

STUDY 1

EFFECTS OF A 12-WEEK YOGA VERSUS A 12-WEEK EDUCATIONAL FILM INTERVENTION ON SYMPTOMS OF RESTLESS LEGS SYNDROME AND RELATED OUTCOMES: AN EXPLORATORY RANDOMIZED CONTROLLED TRIAL
https://jcsm.aasm.org/doi/10.5664/jcsm.8134

RESULTS:
"Both groups showed significant improvement in RLS symptoms and severity."

CONCLUSION:
"Findings of this exploratory RCT suggest that yoga may be effective in reducing RLS symptoms and symptom severity, decreasing perceived stress, and improving mood and sleep in adults with RLS."

STUDY 2

EFFICACY OF AN EIGHT-WEEK YOGA INTERVENTION ON SYMPTOMS OF RESTLESS LEGS SYNDROME (RLS): A PILOT STUDY
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3673587

RESULTS:
"At follow-up, participants demonstrated striking reductions in RLS symptoms and symptom severity."

CONCLUSION:
"These preliminary findings suggest that yoga may be effective in attenuating RLS symptoms and symptom severity, reducing perceived stress, and improving sleep and mood in women with RLS."

Both studies had very low numbers (like 13 finished in one study, I think even less in the other). One study excluded patients taking dopamine agonists, one did not report how many of their patients were on DAs. And at least at first glance I couldn't make out how many took opioids, and if the RLS severity score was for treated or untreated patients. Which is very curious because this is the first question I would ask.

And the studies weren't very long (8 and 12 weeks). A sticking point is typically if an intervention that gives short term results will hold up in the long run.

I'd expect any form of awareness or meditation to be positive in general (yoga, progressive muscle relaxation, breathing, whatever). But I'm not at all sure if the results of these studies would hold up (a) for a larger number of subjects, and (b) for patients with severe RLS and on medication, as the typical sufferer in this forum.

I've been practising yoga for years. The only time I get a benefit for my RLS is in the middle of the night, otherwise not.

I'm not sure why a larger number of subjects would change anything?

Also, the reason I post this information is not to say "this is going to cure you." It's another tool in a concerted natural effort to become free of RLS. If you do enough positive things, whatever that may be, you will be in better shape.

I had severe RLS and yoga/stretching was a helpful part of my overall routine.

Just because someone is on medication doesn't mean that yoga or stretching won't help.

The foundation of recovery from RLS will ALWAYS be diet.

As I told the other person replying, it's a helpful tool in an overall effort to lessen RLS symptoms.

Frunobulax wrote: ↑

Mon Mar 04, 2024 4:08 pm

Both studies had very low numbers (like 13 finished in one study, I think even less in the other). One study excluded patients taking dopamine agonists, one did not report how many of their patients were on DAs. And at least at first glance I couldn't make out how many took opioids, and if the RLS severity score was for treated or untreated patients. Which is very curious because this is the first question I would ask.

And the studies weren't very long (8 and 12 weeks). A sticking point is typically if an intervention that gives short term results will hold up in the long run.

I'd expect any form of awareness or meditation to be positive in general (yoga, progressive muscle relaxation, breathing, whatever). But I'm not at all sure if the results of these studies would hold up (a) for a larger number of subjects, and (b) for patients with severe RLS and on medication, as the typical sufferer in this forum.

I'm not sure why a larger number of subjects would change anything?

Also, the reason I post this information is not to say "this is going to cure you." It's another tool in a concerted natural effort to become free of RLS. If you do enough positive things, whatever that may be, you will be in better shape.

I had severe RLS and yoga/stretching was a helpful part of my overall routine.

Just because someone is on medication doesn't mean that yoga or stretching won't help.

The foundation of recovery from RLS will ALWAYS be diet.

Yankiwi wrote: ↑

Tue Mar 05, 2024 1:33 am

I've been practising yoga for years. The only time I get a benefit for my RLS is in the middle of the night, otherwise not.

It's another tool in a concerted natural effort to become free of RLS. If you do enough positive things, whatever that may be, you will be in better shape.

I'm in excellent shape. Practice yoga, lift weights, walk 7k or more most days, swim laps. But it's my gabapentin and codeine that allow me to get six hours of broken sleep each night. Before gabapentin I was up half the night crying.

Yankiwi wrote: ↑

Thu Mar 07, 2024 12:08 am

I'm in excellent shape. Practice yoga, lift weights, walk 7k or more most days, swim laps. But it's my gabapentin and codeine that allow me to get six hours of broken sleep each night. Before gabapentin I was up half the night crying.

That's great. But this is the Non-prescription Medicines, Supplements, Diet board, for people that want to avoid taking medications.

There are natural ways of lessening RLS symptoms that people are interested in finding out about.

I'm living proof that natural remedies work.

CalmLegsJL wrote: ↑

Wed Mar 06, 2024 6:24 am

I'm not sure why a larger number of subjects would change anything?

Yes. Medicine is full of underpowered studies that were reversed later. That's just the way statistics work. Throw a dice 10 times and you may come up 8 times with head even if it's a fair dice, just by chance. Throw it 10000 times and the chance of getting head 8000 times is, IDK, probably less than 1 in the number of atoms in our solar system.

The worse issue is that the medication status of the participants wasn't known in one study and patients on drugs were excluded in the other. There are 1001 things that may help people with mild RLS (= don't take drugs on a regular basis) but are almost always ineffective for those of us that have to take drugs every day.

Neither of that means that yoga doesn't help. My personal guess is that it won't do much for more severe cases. (I tried yoga, autogenic training and progressive muscle relaxation, zero effect.) But we can't tell unless we have larger studies.

CalmLegsJL wrote: ↑

Thu Mar 07, 2024 7:52 am

That's great. But this is the Non-prescription Medicines, Supplements, Diet board, for people that want to avoid taking medications.

Not sure I like that wording.

Many people who have to take drugs look for nonpharma interventions. As they should, because drugs typically come with a hefty pricetag attached, with side effects, augmentation and dependence. But there are plenty of sufferers who can't manage without drugs.

I have tried pretty much everything under the sun that's supposed to help RLS, and I still have to take drugs. (Even though I did manage to cut my dose a bit.)

I agree with Frunobulax's concern with that wording. Many who have mild to moderate RLS that can be controlled by diet and/or exercise have a difficult time believing that their "treatment" regime will not work for everyone. My RLS is officially rated as "Very Severe" and can only be controlled with multiple medications. I would never dream of suggesting that everyone take three RLS drugs like I have to. If diet, exercise and natural treatments work for you, rejoice and pray that your RLS doesn't get too much worse with age. And then do not pretend to judge those of us whose only choices are to take multiple meds or suicide (which unfortunately happens to RLS patients far too often).

Rustsmith wrote: ↑

Fri Mar 08, 2024 12:51 am

I agree with Frunobulax's concern with that wording. Many who have mild to moderate RLS that can be controlled by diet and/or exercise have a difficult time believing that their "treatment" regime will not work for everyone. My RLS is officially rated as "Very Severe" and can only be controlled with multiple medications. I would never dream of suggesting that everyone take three RLS drugs like I have to. If diet, exercise and natural treatments work for you, rejoice and pray that your RLS doesn't get too much worse with age. And then do not pretend to judge those of us whose only choices are to take multiple meds or suicide (which unfortunately happens to RLS patients far too often).

I'm not judging you or anyone. What I'm saying is, this is a board for natural remedies. So, why not take your medication talk to the other boards where the visitors are interested in that sort of thing?

I just find it curious that people on medication keep popping onto this board to pick the scientific studies apart.

Also, you have no idea of the severity of my RLS. I can tell you that it was extreme. I often had to stand up to watch TV. I couldn't hold my wife's hand. Suicide and chopping my legs off were nightly thoughts.

The people on this board are telling me that their RLS is extreme and the only solution is medication. That's another way of saying that my RLS wasn't extreme because natural remedies worked for me.

CalmLegsJL wrote: ↑

Fri Mar 08, 2024 5:06 am

I just find it curious that people on medication keep popping onto this board to pick the scientific studies apart.
[...]
The people on this board are telling me that their RLS is extreme and the only solution is medication. That's another way of saying that my RLS wasn't extreme because natural remedies worked for me.

You imply that patients that take drugs are demeaning in some way to non-prescription management. With respect, but there wasn't a single instance my 10+ years on this forum where I saw something like this. On the contrary, the people who suffer the worst (and often have severe RLS despite taking multiple drugs) are often the most interested in managing the disease via "lifestyle" changes.

Nobody ever claimed that your RLS wasn't severe. Please keep the discussion friendly and to the point.

Also, you have no idea of the severity of my RLS. I can tell you that it was extreme. I often had to stand up to watch TV. I couldn't hold my wife's hand. Suicide and chopping my legs off were nightly thoughts.

This forum is open to everyone. Many of us who take medications tried to survive RLS without them and therefore have experience with many of the Non-prescription treatments. A true discussion involves an exchange of information from both sides.

As for me, part of my role as moderator is to provide my input on most of the discussions on all of the forums of the board, not just the ones that relate to my personal interests.

As Frunobulax said, I didn't say that your RLS isn't severe. I just observed that many people who believe their RLS is severe have not been through an IRLSSG rating by their doctor and or do not know their score. My score with medication is usually around 20 (on a scale of 0 to 40), which is classified as moderate. Without medication, my score is 31 or 32 which is classified as the highest level of very severe.

As for me, I would say that you should be happy that you are able to watch TV standing up. I had to give up that and many other of my favorite activities long ago. My legs are continually moving, even as I type this at my standing desk. There have been many nights that I spent the entire night out walking the neighborhood because me legs wouldn't allow me to even sit. And I didn't sleep the next day either because I had to work.

I have had several instances where I had to keep moving for 7 days with zero sleep. I was even thrown into a psychiatric facility for a week by an ignorant ER doctor. I had gone to the ER so that they would call my doctor because I hadn't slept for 3 days (they didn't call my doctor). I couldn't go out to wak that night because it was snowing, here was a strong wind and I couldn't stand the idea of walking around in circles in my living room all night long. The ER doc saw me pacing around the exam room and assumed that I was experiencing opioid withdrawal syndrome without even talking to me. Once I was at the facility, they withheld some of my meds until they saw me pacing around the ward for 10 hrs after I went through a painful withdrawal from my RLS meds that they knew had been prescribed by my doctor who is a medical school professor and sleep medicine researcher. I felt luck to get out of that place alive because their record did show that they had killed patients before the state yanked their business license. That experience has only made my life that much worse, but that is life for someone with a very severe case of RLS. And I feel lucky because I know of cases that are far more severe than mine.