Opioids: sedate or stop movement?

Use this section to discuss your experiences with prescription drugs, iron injections, and other medical interventions that involve the introduction of a drug or medicine into the body. Discuss side effects, successes, failures, published research, information about drug trials, and information about new medications being developed.

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wantok
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Opioids: sedate or stop movement?

Postby wantok » Wed Jun 19, 2019 7:27 am

I thought, with the exception of methadone, that opioids work by sedating sufferers of RLS who sleep through the problem? But I guess I am wrong if people get relief during the day. Where did I get this mistaken idea?

Part of the question is inspired by going on Oxycontin 15 mg. and still not having any sedation which is why I think the methadone I just quit worked so amazingly for sleep because it was so sedating (also during the day unfortunately, and even more causing horrible depression). I still had PLMDs on the methadone, but I was so sleepy I went back to sleep right away. (PLMD is my main problem, minimal RLS)

Rustsmith
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Re: Opioids: sedate or stop movement?

Postby Rustsmith » Wed Jun 19, 2019 2:40 pm

Not only do the opioids provide relief to movement symptoms directly rather than thru sedation, many of us experience the side effect of "alerting", where the opioid actually produces an insomnia like effect. For those of us who experience opioid induced insomnia, we have to take our meds early enough so that the alerting has worn off by bed time.

As for PLMD, there has been surprisingly little research on PLMD even though it is so much easier to detect and measure. I have severe RLS and severe PLMD, so my doctor has me taking an opioid for my RLS and I still take pramipexole for the PLMD. She sent me for a sleep study a year or two ago just to confirm that my PLMD was under control, and it was.

Of the PLMD research that has been done, it is beginning to appear that it may be a type of RLS. The genetics of the two conditions appears to have a connection, they respond to many of the same medications and statistics says that the two have some sort of connection.
Steve

Augmentation Evaluation http://bb.rls.org/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=9005

Opinions presented by Discussion Board Moderators are personal in nature and do not, in any way, represent the opinion of the RLS Foundation, and are not medical advice.

wantok
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Joined: Fri Apr 01, 2016 3:14 pm

Re: Opioids: sedate or stop movement?

Postby wantok » Thu Jun 20, 2019 1:03 am

Thanks. I certainly haven't found much on PLMD. I thought Mirapex caused augmentation? I got this from my mom. She took Mirapex. Yeah, I know about the alerting. Even the Methadone caused alerting, at the same time as sedation. I would take it before 5pm, but I did appreciate that I got a few hours "awake" from it while mainly it turned me into the walking dead.

sleepdancer2
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Re: Opioids: sedate or stop movement?

Postby sleepdancer2 » Tue Jun 25, 2019 9:08 am

Yes, Mirapex can cause augmentation, but I don't think everyone runs into that issue. I augmented on it. As to sleeping through movements vs stopping movements, ideally one could stop the movements which would result in better sustained sleep. If one is sedated and still has movements, there will likely still be sleep stage disruption with the movements and resultant lack of restorative sleep. Also, if the muscles don't rest during sleep, they can't repair and recover.
My Augmentation Sleep Video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jE7WA_5c73c

wantok
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Joined: Fri Apr 01, 2016 3:14 pm

Re: Opioids: sedate or stop movement?

Postby wantok » Tue Jun 25, 2019 5:21 pm

Yes, it is much better if they stop the movements. I just wasn't sure they did and they must because people take them during the day when they have that problem. Since I have PLMD, I'm not so sure.

badnights
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Re: Opioids: sedate or stop movement?

Postby badnights » Fri Jun 28, 2019 5:27 am

I thought, with the exception of methadone, that opioids work by sedating sufferers of RLS who sleep through the problem? But I guess I am wrong if people get relief during the day. Where did I get this mistaken idea?
My doctor who was prescribing hydromorph contin to me thought the same thing! She was young and bright and eager to learn, though; I brought her some papers; one was about an experiment on rat brain tissue (primarily dopaminergic cells) showing that although iron deficiency caused the brain cells' DNA to fragment and the cells to die, administering opioids would prevent or delay this. She understood better after that; but I wonder sometimes how much I assume, because once, when I mentioned that I'd been having bad symptoms, she asked me what I meant by "symptoms".

Re sleeping thru it - - I don't think we can actually sleep thru it, unless it's mild, and then as sleepdancer said, we don't get restorative sleep. I've been totally doped up on sleeping meds when my "symptoms" weren't controlled, and there was no way I could lie down or even stand still. As you said, the walking dead. Or the walking tortured dead. Stumbling into walls, in agony, because I needed to move more than usual (presumably because the sedation/relaxation caused by the sedative triggered symptoms even while walking) yet was less able to do so (part of brain was actually asleep).
Beth - Wishing you a restful sleep tonight
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I am a volunteer moderator. My posts are not medical advice. My posts do not reflect RLS Foundation opinion.

ViewsAskew
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Re: Opioids: sedate or stop movement?

Postby ViewsAskew » Fri Jun 28, 2019 8:29 pm

I echo Beth - I am awakened from dreaming at times, deeply asleep, and I am running or things in my dreams are making me move my body. Once I awaken enough, I realize I have symptoms and there is NO way I could stay asleep. When taking benzos or similar drugs, I am like a drunk, wobbling around, stumbling into things. Not a good thing! Once older, I could see myself falling and breaking a hip!
Ann - Take what you need, leave the rest

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Opinions presented by Discussion Board Moderators are personal in nature and do not, in any way, represent the opinion of the RLS Foundation, and are not medical advice.

Frunobulax
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Re: Opioids: sedate or stop movement?

Postby Frunobulax » Fri Jul 12, 2019 12:11 pm

ViewsAskew wrote:I echo Beth - I am awakened from dreaming at times, deeply asleep, and I am running or things in my dreams are making me move my body.


I hardly ever dream at the moment. About once a month I will dream something and remember on the morning after that I did dream, but never the contents of the dream. Some people attribute it to my Pyrroluria, but for me it's a marker of restful sleep - I had phases when my sleep became more restful, and in those phases I would dream a lot more.

I wake up from the urge to move my legs at times, but never in conjunction with a dream. Curious.


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