Panic attacks and my psychiatris: not working! PLEASE Help!

[Holland]

I am currently seeing a doctor for my extreme and frequent panic attacks, which also bring on anxiety for days after and I've suffered with for more than 10 years now. I have been seen before for this, and while I diligently have tried every ssri known to man, the only thing that has seemed to help me feel any sense of relief from the attacks has been clonazepam, which I am taking now with lexapro.

In the beginning, everything seemed to start to improve: I was on a very low dose of lexapro (5 mgs) and a very low dose of the clonazepam (.5 mg's twice daily) of course, going from no help at all to some help had an immediate impact and improvement on my life the first few weeks.

Soon after my next monthly visit though, the attacks were starting up again, and still frequently enough to disrupt my life and worry me. My lexapro got upped to 10mg's, and still- no improvement, but I decided to wait it out.

NEXT VISIT: 3rd month
After discussing the concerns with my doctor he decided to not increase my clonazepam dose but instead jump up to 20 mg's of lexapro, who's side effects where already becoming unbearable to deal with, on top of the panic attacks that weren't improving at all. My sleep patterns are screwed up, I feel more anxious on the higher dose of lexapro, and I'm getting all kinds of weird shock-like buzzes/tics at night.

I feel like I just want to come out and say it: Up my damn clonazepam dosage! I'm sick of "waiting it out" for the lexapro...it's been long enough and the side effects are not going away. But since clonazepam is a drug to be handled with caution, I dont know how to tell my doctor what I really think I need without appearing to be "drug seeking" like others who have potentially ruined alot of chances for people like me to get what works best for them. I'm about ready to give up and just get off all medications now because my mental condition is back where I started from, except now it includes a hefty medical bill for the lexapro, who's effects are slowly turning me into a recluse.

what can I say to my doctor about the clonazepam? If I could have anything at all it would be a drug-free remedy and a normal lifestyle..but everything from meditation, acupuncture, intense therapy and even hypnosis have failed me. I just feel so stuck. Any advice would be appreciated, I just feel so alone right now with this dilemma.

Holland

[tazzer]

sorry you are having such a rough time. it is hard to get doctors to listen to you, i mean its your body you know how you feel, but some of the doctors have this God complex that they know everything and they apparently think they know how you feel. i lucked out with my doctor, after my second visit i told him hey, this is my body and i know when this friggin med wears off, i don't care what the drug co. says on how long it last, i know its wearing off and i am miserable the rest of the dang day. so either up the dose or put me on something else. i also told him the requip was making me so sick i couldn't keep my head up and lucky he took my word after my little fit. if the lexapro is making you worse, make another appt and tell him. if he doesn't listen maybe you should find another doctor. i have always been pretty healthy and didn't see doctors too much except for colds and babies, so i really didn't know what buttheads some of them could be until i got this lovely rls. don't let one doctor make you miserable. there are plenty to wade through. find one that suits you and will actually listen to you.

i wish you luck

dee

[Holland]

Thank you so much for the support and advice. I am planning on being very straightforward at my next appointment because I have nothing left to lose right now, as it is. I'm going to calmly and sternly tell my dr. exactly what is going on, (unless I start bawling, which I do on occasion at the dr's when I am under stress) and he'd better listen! And usually I am in and out of his office in 5 minutes or less- have a little chat, la dee da, write the script, and be done with me. Well this time it's not going to be a quick little session, and I hope he really listens good this time.

[jan3213]

Welcome Holland!

Dee gave you such great advice. I just want to say don't give up on finding a doctor who will listen if this one turns out to be a bad apple. There are docs who really care, it just may take a while to find one.

I'm glad that you're going to your doctor with new resolve! I like what dee said: It's your body and who knows better than you what makes you feel worse? No one!!!

I wish you the very best! Please let us know what happened, okay? We're here rooting for you.

Jan

[ctravel12]

Welcome Holland. I am so sorry what you are going through to get the meds that will help with your rls. I do not know why drs do not listen to their patients and like you said they take about 5 mins. or less. I do not blame you for saying that he is going to listen this time. Sometimes you have to do something to get their attention.

I agree with clonazapem with being a control substance (I am on 1mg) but if it is working that is what is important. Have the dr walk in your shoes for a day, week, month, etc and am sure he will be changing his tune real quiick.

Please keep us posted on how your next appt. goes and hope that you are feeling much better.

Holland, you have found a good board as everyone is very supportive and caring. If you just want to talk, vent, etc. go ahead as we are hear to listen and hopefully help you. We will be here no matter what to give you all the support that you need. This board literally saved my life. I may or some other members may say just one thing that will be the turning point (a good one ) for you.

[vinton]

I have many years of experience and if you find the right AD you will be reee. In my case it was effexor.

As for benzos there is too much to say. Go to benzo.org.uk

Good luck

Vinton

[Kwazylegs]

Welcome Holland,
Sorry for the late reply. I've been prescribed both benzodiazepines and anti-depressants to treat my panic/generalized anxiety/depression/RLS/pain and insomnia, so I'll share my experiences with these meds here. Responses to medications (as well as adverse effects) vary greatly among patients...some people taking energizing AD's fall asleep, and others taking sedating medications experience insomnia. I've learned this over about 20 years...I personally am very sensitive to medications, and so I have to be very self-aware of how I feel while taking them. I've tried nearly every AD currently marketed...the older tricyclics like Elavil, the SSRI's like Prozac, Zooloft, Paxil, etc., and some of the atypical ones like Wellbutrin, Effexor, and Cymbalta. I tried Lexapro when it was first released, and I felt wired, sleepless, and my RLS went goofy (like with most antidepressants I've tried). Many doctors will prescribe antidepressants for anxiety/panic simply because they don't feel comfortable prescribing potentially dependence-prone medications like clonazepam. I've been taking .5mg clonazepam 2 or three times per day for the past 4 years. It was originally prescribed for panic attacks, and more recently for my RLS and resulting insomnia. I haven't had a panic attack in 4 years, I'm sleeping better and my night-time RLS symptoms are less bothersome, and I apparently haven't become tolerant of the medication, because I haven't needed to increase the dose. I've read the benzo.org website, and I too was concerned about possibly going thrugh hell trying to discontinue the medication. But then it occurred to me that if the med was apparently still working to control three medical problems which previously interfered with my quality of life much more than they do now, and if I haven't needed to increase my dosage beyond what was originally prescribed, then why would I want to "rock the boat" by attempting to wean myself off of them? Many medications (including Paxil) have some risk of dependency and withdrawal, contrary to what some in the pharmaceutical industry and medical profession believe. I hope that you and your doctor come into a better working relationship so that your symptoms are controlled better than they are now...none of us should have to endure pain/discomfort/suffering if effective meds are available. ---Andy

[Kwazylegs]

Holland,
By the way, have you tried your current dose of .5mg of clonazepam twice daily without any anti-depressant? Maybe, like me, the "wired" feeling isn't from too little of the clonazepam, but rather from the AD interfering with the benzodiazepine's benefits. Just a thought. ---Andy

[JudyH]

It has been my experience that doctors and medications almost always make whatever is wrong with you far worse. And, it doesn't matter what is wrong with you, mental or physical. If they do manage to remove something that needs to be removed, like a gall bladder say, they put you through absolute hell and almost kill you in the process.

I have had very bad panic attacks before. Virtually every single physician I went to was ridiculously rude to outright cruel. I finally came to the sad realization that I was paying someone over $100/15 minutes to abuse me. I couldn't even PAY a physician to fake concern or some basic social amenities, let alone effective treatment of my symptoms.

My advice is to wean yourself off of all meds. Do this by reducing the doses slowly and keeping stimulus to a minimum. By this I mean, stay in the house and away from people as much as possible. Avoid noise. You can probably read on line how slowly you have to go to get off of everything. You will probably have horribly bad nightmares for a couple of nights and feel unbelievably nervous and anxious for about a week unless you go very slowly. It will help if you have faith in God and pray alot.

Then decide that doctors are never going to help you with whatever is wrong with you. Not only will they not help you, they almost certainly will harm you. Try to learn about whatever the condition is that you have and treat it yourself. Do not take medications of any kind. Not even vitamins.

Come to grips with your own mortality. Figure, whatever is wrong with you, you are going to die anyway. Do you want to be tortured to death in a hospital or by a physician, or would you prefer to die with some degree of peace and autonomy in your own home?

Anxiety and panic disorders wax and wane. They will go away for long periods of time, and then come back again at times of stress. Figure that you will eventually get well again without any intervention whatsoever.
It will help if you do 30 minutes of aerobic exercise every day, eat healthy, and stick to a schedule for going to bed and waking up.
Going outside to exercise might be nerve wracking and make you worse. I advise exercising in the house if you can. Exercise is important.
If you pray for acceptance, God will give you peace of mind whatever the outcome. I wish you a speedy recovery. Pray. Stay away from doctors and medicine. That's the best I got.

[jumpy]

Nothing personal, Judy..but you've got to be kidding!! I would be dead by now with no thyroid, diabetes and not to mention very painful RLS.. Personally I'll take all the help I can get..Pat

[becat]

Good Morning all,
Trying to catch up on my reading while I have the morning cup of coffee......nope it's leaded today. I have really had a HECK of a week or so and I need the lead.
I wanted to comment to JudyH, as I did read yesterdays progress in NON-PHarm.
Judy, your so mad, at us or just the medical industry as a whole? I'm with Ann about being aggressive toward others on this board. It's not done and if so, we prefer people take it outside the board. Please don't be hostile and judge those of us that have chosen to take meds.. It comes down to this, you don't live in my body and deal with my life. I can't, nor would want to make choices for you either. I'm no wuss, I'm not druggy, I am a person wanting to enjoy my life and live in it, not on the side lines.
You don't take meds, that is cool by me. I'm happy you found a way to endure RLS. I am happy, truly for you, but reserve the judgments on those of us that are different, just out of respect.
I have many examples of good, kind, caring doctors within my life and the funny thing, never went to many of them til I was in my 20's. I've had the same family GP for 19+ yrs now. We grew up together as parents and I adore him. So a blanket statement like yours is just overboard.
As for those that take medications. I'm one of them. Tried, and sometimes still do, different ones, along with my vitamins and supplements. I added acupuncture to the list for the RLS pain this past year. I go to the chiropractor several times a year ( another awesome doc).
But, Judy I have no quality of life at, almost 43, without medication. I have no sleep, just pain and it grows throughout the day.
I'm not the only one here that thinks this is a wonderful place to share our ups and downs, our smiles and giggles, our shoulders and ears when people need them. This is a family we've built here and anyone is welcome. I think you might have much to offer, but please I ask that you tone the anger and harshness for a bit.
No one should ever stop taking any meds without the doctor's knowledge and help.
We like to educate about RLS around here, mostly we end up with some awesome supportive, well RLS educated people. I hope you understand that what your writing is understandable, but does not apply to us all.
Be well
Lynne

[tazzer]

ummmm judy, i am just curious as to where you graduated medical school? it is my understanding that if you are not a doctor, it is a very dangerous and a misguided thing to do on your part to advise people not to take their medicine. NO ONE SHOULD STOP THEIR MEDICATION WITHOUT THEIR DOCTORS CONSENT. This is a support discussion board, not a board where we tell people to do things that could be detrimental to their health. I really and truly hope you stop and think about what you said Judy and the consequences it could bring. So if that is the best you got, keep it to yourself! Better yet we'll pray for you not to be so judgemental.

dee

[jan3213]

Judy,

Becat is absolutely right. This board is a "safe" place for people with RLS. We are already so misunderstood by the general public, we really don't need criticism from someone on the board.

As for not taking medication--that is certainly everyone's choice. While many people here choose not to take medication, many of us DO take medication because our qualify of life has been so jepordized by RLS to the point where we never slept and many of us were in constant pain. And, even though you might think that your RLS is as "bad" as someone else's, there's no way to compare. You aren't in my body and I'm not in your body.

As for doctors and medication, in general, I respect your deicision not to take any medication or see doctors. That is YOUR choice. However, we also have a choice, Judy. And you should respect us, as well.

I can't imagine not taking medications for such things as heart problems, diabetes, cancer, etc. I'm not sure if that's where you were going, and really don't want to debate you.

Again, this is a SUPPORT board, Judy, and I would appreciate it if you would tone your posts down.

Thank you.
Jan

[ctravel12]

Judy, I just read your post and am appauled at you telling everyone to stay away from drs and just pray and keep your faith. Believe me, I have alot of faith and without God in my life I would not be where I am today. God comes into many forms and this board is certainly one of them.

Like the other members if you do not want to take meds, that is fine,, but do not preach how others should. Everybody bodies reacts differently and if the meds helps me, I am not going to stop. Believe me I did stop once and what a nightmare.

This board is for support and alot people need this to get through just one hour, day or week. Try walking in their shoes just one day and see how you feel. It is not a pretty picture.

The way that I read is that you probably do not have rls, or not bad enough to take meds and that is wonderful but that does not for the majority of the people.

[SquirmingSusan]

I've read the benzo.org website, and I too was concerned about possibly going thrugh hell trying to discontinue the medication. But then it occurred to me that if the med was apparently still working to control three medical problems which previously interfered with my quality of life much more than they do now, and if I haven't needed to increase my dosage beyond what was originally prescribed, then why would I want to "rock the boat" by attempting to wean myself off of them? Many medications (including Paxil) have some risk of dependency and withdrawal, contrary to what some in the pharmaceutical industry and medical profession believe. I hope that you and your doctor come into a better working relationship so that your symptoms are controlled better than they are now...none of us should have to endure pain/discomfort/suffering if effective meds are available. ---Andy

OMG, I don't even believe what I'm reading in here. It seems that we have a very angry and lonely person whose only means of getting attention is to post inflammatory comments in discussion boards. My only concern is that someone who is in distress might actually take her advice.

Kwazylegs, I'm with you, that we don't need to endure suffering if effective meds are available. And we all know our own bodies and are intelligent beings, and need to make the doctor understand.

Personally, I've been to the benzos.org website and it seems a bit overly hysterical. Dependence is different from addiction, and so what if I become "dependent" on a med. My mother likes to tell me that I take too many meds, LOL. But where would she be without her blood pressure meds? Yes, she's "dependent" on them.

In my experience, some antidepressants can cause more dependency issuues than benzos. I was on diazepam for chronic vertigo for 10 years, and quit cold turkey with no adverse effects. I only quit because I haven't been getting vertigo nearly as often, and I wanted to see what would happen if I quit taking it. Only very infrequent vertigo, and I have the diazepam to take if I need it. When I was having extreme, frequent vertigo, yes, I was "dependent" on the valium, because it controlled the symptoms, and if I hadn't found something that worked, I would have put a gun to my head.

I was also on Effexor when I quit taking the diazepam. Effexor screwed up my sleep schedule in a huge way, and when I quit the diazepam, my depression lessened (yes, depression can be a side effect of long term benzo use) and I decided to try to get off that. The withdrawal effects from Effexor were terrible, and lasted about 2 months.

So which drug caused more "dependency" in my? Certainly the Effexor. But if it had been working well for me, without adverse side effects, to controll my depression and help me live a normal life, SO WHAT?

And if I need daily narcotics to let me lead a normal life due to the RLS, so what? They're one of the safest, longterm classes of drugs out there.

These are just my own experiences and opinions. You all know your own bodies. Do what you need to do.

Susan