Med trials/insomnia/depression

Use this section to discuss your experiences with prescription drugs, iron injections, and other medical interventions that involve the introduction of a drug or medicine into the body. Discuss side effects, successes, failures, published research, information about drug trials, and information about new medications being developed.

Important: Posts and information in this section are based on personal experiences and recommendations; they should not be considered a substitute for the advice of a healthcare provider.
rlm
Posts: 26
Joined: Sun Feb 23, 2014 1:41 am

Med trials/insomnia/depression

Post by rlm »

Hello all,

It's been slightly over a year since I've posted. Some of that time things have been decent with my RLS but this summer my life has disappeared into the RLS abyss. I need some support and advice.

A hopefully short history: I augmented on Mirapex and went through the nasty withdrawal with the aid of oxycodone. My neurologist wasn't being helpful so Dr. B suggested the Mayo clinic. Went there twice and started on Neupro and switched to a local sleep doc. The patch worked for about nine months and in retrospect, was heaven for awhile. Then I started to augment so I was switched to Horizant at the beginning of the summer and was also supplementing with oxycodone. It was not pretty; I tried it for about six weeks and could only sleep for 1-2 hrs. at a stretch plus I was very drugged feeling. I previously tried gabapentin and Lyrica; they didn't work and I couldn't tolerate them. Finally, my doctor agreed with me that any gabapentin drugs are not for me.

Currently, I am on ropinirole because he says there's a chance I won't augment on it so I'm trying it. I'm on 1 mg in the evening and it does stop my leg symptoms. It seems to cause insomnia, though. I never slept well on Mirapex but this is even worse. Is this a side effect? For my insomnia, I now have a 5mg zolpidem. I was worried that it would work too well but have experienced just the opposite. It gives me about 4-5 hours of good sleep and then stops.

I am starting to wonder if I'm already augmenting on the ropinirole because I'm having to take it earlier now than when I first started. I get the feeling that my doctor wants me to continue on any meds for 2-3 weeks before giving up. Is this the standard?

My life has been turned upside down by sleep-deprivation and drugs. I'm depressed and weepy and no longer am able to do all the things I once did. Needless to say it's been a very dark time and I know you can relate. My husband is very supportive but it is taking its toll on him, too.

Is it a good idea to overlap meds when switching or is it better to withdraw totally from one before starting the next? I was reading some posts about stopping all drugs for awhile to clear the brain (if I understood correctly). Sounds like an interesting idea but scary as hell. I'm anticipating that I will soon be coming off ropinirole.

Or perhaps use it only a few days per week along with whatever drug is next?

Any advice and all support will be greatly appreciated.

Thank you, thank you.

figflower

Re: Med trials/insomnia/depression

Post by figflower »

Rlm are you on any of the following: HRT, statins, diabetes medication, antidepressants, antacids, melatonin, antihistamines? Any and all of these may have triggered your RLS which sounds like for you began later in life, somewhat. Did any other conditions begin around the same time as your RLS? Have you been checked for anemia? Did your eating patterns change, ie weight gain? For many, many, many (not all, just most) RLS sufferers, their RLS is triggered by a short term problem or a drug that can be stopped but then they start on a long term solution such as the DAs which only further down-regulates our already down-regulated dopamine receptors. The vast majority of the world can take the above drugs and NEVER develop RLS. But those of us who are pre-disposed to RLS (meaning we have genetically shoddy dopamine receptors and low brain iron), such as myself, and possibly you, cannot take these drugs without developing RLS. Or we develop RLS while pregnant or after spinal anesthesia or during menopause. And with these particular situations the RLS will usually stop after delivery, or after a few months after the spinal, or once our hormones settle down. But if you don't know this and start on the DAs it becomes a never ending battle. So to make a long story short, is there anything in your life that can be making your RLS worse or even triggering it?

ViewsAskew
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Re: Med trials/insomnia/depression

Post by ViewsAskew »

RLM- so sorry you are going through this. I've been in a similar place (more than once...seems cyclical) and I hear you about how even a supportive spouse finds it hard. I totally can relate to the weepy place you're in. I'm not there now, but there have been times that I'd have jumped off the cliff if one had presented itself. I didn't have the energy to go find one. Guess that is a good thing.

The insomnia that accompanies some of these drugs can be terrible. is medical marijuana available? Dr B has told me he's seeing good results with it. Several of our members are finding it very helpful.

Do you know your serum ferritin? My story may give you some hope. I augmented on pramipexole in 7-10 days. I augmented in one day on ropinerole. So, I thought I'd never be able to take them once I had used methadone to get through the severe augmentation. Because of side effects of methadone and that I had tolerance, several years ago I started alternating methadone with pramipexole - just two days on P, then two on M. I stopped after a couple years because of depression related to the P. After a year back on the M, I needed an increase and just was not willing.

So, I had the first of two iron infusions. At the time, my serum ferritin was in the teens. Within two to three months after getting it, my SF was below 100. I only had one week of reduced symptoms before it was too low to help. I had a second infusion with last fall. This time, I had a reduction of symptoms for much longer - but still not that long (a couple months). But, since my serum ferritin was now in the high 100's and staying there, I wondered if I could take pramiepexole again without issue - at least for awhile. Because if I could, I could alternate. I also had resolved low vitamin D, which was likely contributing to the depression - my hope was that I wouldn't have any.

I'm up to 3 weeks of taking pramiepxole without augmentation. For me, gabapentin helps with sleep, though there are other issues, no question. For the 4th week of the month, I take methadone. This time, I'm going to see if I can make it 4 weeks. I do have some mood issues, but not as bad as before.

I am not saying that what I did will work - it might not. But, saying that there are options even when it doesn't seem like it.

Also, do look at the threads about people using kratom. It isn't for everyone, but several people here are very pleased with it.
Ann - Take what you need, leave the rest

Managing Your RLS

Opinions presented by Discussion Board Moderators are personal in nature and do not, in any way, represent the opinion of the RLS Foundation, and are not medical advice.

Rustsmith
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Re: Med trials/insomnia/depression

Post by Rustsmith »

rlm, if you augmented on pramipexole and then on Neupro, it is a good bet that you would augment very quickly on ropinirole. Ropinirole and pramipexole are both short half life dopamine agonists and Neupro is a longer half life, extended release dopamine agonist. Directionally, it is believed that augmentation should be less of a problem with the longer lasting products like Neupro. However, it has not yet been around long enough for the doctors to get a good idea of whether this reduction in probability of augmentation for Neupro is actually true.

Personally, I have also augmented on pramipexole and am currently waiting to get off of Neupro. My doctor is one of the RLS Foundation Quality Center doctors and his statement to me about my future was that after Neupro, I will be finished with the DAs and will have to move on to the opiates. I should also mention that I am currently taking gabapentin along with the Neupro. He tried to move me to Horizant, but it did not provide any improvement over gabapentin for me.

As for the insomnia angle, a "normal" side effect of the DAs can be drowsiness. However, we all tend to react differently to many of these medications and there can be good reasons why our side effects are different from the general population. I believe that Neupro has caused me to experience a form of insomnia where I wake up between 2 and 4AM. No conventional sleep aid medication seems to be able to change that. On the other hand, pramipexole helped to put me to sleep, so go figure.
Steve

https://www.mayoclinicproceedings.org/a ... 0/fulltext
Opinions presented by Discussion Board Moderators are personal in nature and do not, in any way, represent the opinion of the RLS Foundation, and are not medical advice.

JimmyLegs44
Posts: 90
Joined: Thu Oct 01, 2009 5:24 am

Re: Med trials/insomnia/depression

Post by JimmyLegs44 »

rlm, I would encourage you to try a 30 to 90 day drug holiday if possible to see where your baseline symptoms are at off of medication.

I personally have lost faith in the medical community, first for getting us into this DA augmentation mess, and now for suggesting that Neupro is a viable option after augmenting on a shorter-acting DA. Common sense should tell us that Neupro is not a good long-term solution, especially for those that have already augmented on a shorter-acting DA, as augmentation is inevitable and withdrawal will be pure hell. To me, augmentation is a sign that our dopamine receptors have had enough of the DA bombardment. The only answer is the long, hellish withdrawal from DA's.

Finally, look into Seratame. Read some of the material on their website (http://stopsrestlesslegs.com/). In my opinion, they make a pretty convincing argument. I've been taking it for just a week now, and am already seeing a reduction in the severity of my RLS. That is very promising to me, as I am currently augmenting on pramipexole. I'm hoping Seratame will ease the symptoms of my next withdrawal attempt, and that once I'm able to get off pramipexole, Seratame (and hopefully an improved diet) will significantly lessen (if not eliminate) my RLS. As a result of my noted frustrations with the medical community, I'm now putting my faith in a more natural approach.
The best way out is always through. - Robert Frost

rlm
Posts: 26
Joined: Sun Feb 23, 2014 1:41 am

Re: Med trials/insomnia/depression

Post by rlm »

Thanks for the post, JimmyLegs.

I assume you mean a drug holiday taking nothing for RLS? I've thought about but it sounds really scary. I never thought I'd be so desperate that I'm reaching for my meds so going without is daunting.

I will look into the seratame and am going to search for other alternatives as well.

ViewsAskew
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Re: Med trials/insomnia/depression

Post by ViewsAskew »

There is definitely an argument to be made for detoxing. It isn't fun, but there are some excellent outcomes. First, your symptoms will likely decrease. From a little to a lot. But, it's much better to know what is really going on. Second, then you can use things with a thoughtful strategy, for lack of a better term. I haven't lost faith with the medical community at JL44 has, but I do think we need to be very wary consumers, educate ourselves, and choose wisely. Easier said than done, but it's about the only way. I'm much happier since I took control of what I do. I'm not saying I don't listen to my doctor, but I chose an up-to-date doctor and one who listens to me. I have to fly half way across the country to do it. I also know we all cannot do that.

Rotating drugs is an excellent strategy. It prevents augmentation, dependence, and tolerance. It isn't for everyone. Choosing alternate drugs is a potentially wise strategy. So is getting an iron infusion if warranted. And, if you do have some imbalance, such as I was very low in vitamin E and it is important to have it at higher levels (for many reasons, not just RLS/WED), then addressing those can help, too.

Do think before jumping into Seratame - the info on the site is not completely accurate. They are marketing something - so they are only showing you want they want. It's not the whole picture and it will not work for many. So, just take what they say with a grain of salt - and read other sources, too.
Ann - Take what you need, leave the rest

Managing Your RLS

Opinions presented by Discussion Board Moderators are personal in nature and do not, in any way, represent the opinion of the RLS Foundation, and are not medical advice.

JimmyLegs44
Posts: 90
Joined: Thu Oct 01, 2009 5:24 am

Re: Med trials/insomnia/depression

Post by JimmyLegs44 »

rlm wrote:I assume you mean a drug holiday taking nothing for RLS?


Correct. Although if the DA withdrawal symptoms are severe, you will likely need oxycodone (as you did before) or another opioid for the first few weeks, to get thru the worst of it, and THEN go on the drug holiday. I personally haven't made it past day two, so I'm certainly not speaking from experience, but to me it just makes sense to let your dopamine receptors heal/reset before deciding on another course of treatment. Dr. B says that takes 2 weeks to 2 months, but I'm giving myself 3 months on my next attempt, just to be on the safe side. I'm on the waiting list for an appointment at Mayo. I certainly hope Dr. Silber doesn't recommend Neupro, or it will be a wasted trip.

We do need to take control of our own treatment regimen. Don't rely on the medical profession or snake oil salesmen, but rather your own instincts and research. Back when I trusted my doctor (this was about 7-8 years ago), I expressed my concerns about the long-term use of pramipexole, but was assured that at my low dose (.25 MG at the time) I had nothing to be concerned about. He indicated that he had Parkinson's patients taking much larger doses. My "low dose" of pramipexole has since resulted in severe augmentation, causing productivity issues at work and many other quality of life issues, and has proven very difficult to get off of. That doctor that I once trusted has since relocated, but I've learned an important lesson about trusting medical professionals, as time has proven him wrong, and I'm the one paying the price, not him.

Pramipexole was a blessing that turned into a curse. Not only did it lose efficacy over time, it made the RLS worse! What's to say the next medication won't end up the same way? I know they are saying there is no risk of augmentation with the alpha-2-delta ligands, but is there enough information out there to make that statement? Are there other long-term concerns that the medical profession cannot possibly know about? I for one am not going to take that chance, unless absolutely necessary.
The best way out is always through. - Robert Frost

Yankiwi
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Location: West Coast, South Island, New Zealand

Re: Med trials/insomnia/depression

Post by Yankiwi »

JimmyLegs44 wrote:We do need to take control of our own treatment regimen.

That's so true. For over 20 years I was mostly unmedicated with nightly torture and very little sleep. The few things I tried didn't work or had adverse effects so I stopped them fairly quickly.
Now I'm so glad or I'd be in dire straits over-prescribed with DAs as so many RLS sufferers are.
Even after a year and a half on Ropinerole, with the help of this forum, I cut back to one .25mg tablet a night and one or two Tramadol (Ultram). It isn't perfect, I still have symptoms but can sleep most of the night and sit for short periods in the evenings.As long as I get up and move the symptoms aren't torture. Prior to Ropinerole it sometimes took two hours of severe pain before I could even consider going back to bed and this was several times a night. Now I'm up for between five minutes to a half hour of moderate stretching and can get back to sleep.
Without taking control of my own treatment I'd have increased my DA dose as all my script said was take one tablet (.25) up to a maximum of four per night. Two was too much!
A good doctor will listen to what we say if we are armed with research and good advice. Without it we are at their mercy.

figflower

Re: Med trials/insomnia/depression

Post by figflower »

Hi Viewsaskew, have you ever wondered why the iron infusions work for anywhere from a few weeks to a few months, but then poop out even though currently your iron stores are high. Naturally I have a theory :). I may have mentioned this to you at some point but I believe that the infused iron, be it over the course of a day or several days, only benefits our RLS brains while it is circulating in the bloodstream. And if it's the right kind of iron (different hospitals use different iron formulas) our brains suck it up. The iron increases the density (and maybe even the number!!!) of our dopamine receptors. I believe they become almost herculean in size compared to before the iron infusion. Then within a day or two after the infusion the iron is gone from the bloodstream in that it has been bound up within the red blood cells and liver and other organs. But not to worry, because you are now the proud owner of bigger, better receptors. Unfortunately, eventually the receptors shrink because our brains just can't seem to call enough up from our stores. This is all just my theory, but it's based on numerous articles that state our receptors need iron to be big and strong. I don't understand why doctors think there is some magical number that if only they could get our stores up to then we would be ok. Even Dr. B talks about John Hopkins and the fact that they got patients stores to 200 even 300 and in this way helped RLS patients??? I think that's the worst thing they can possibly do!!! The higher the stores the less likely iron will be absorbed from the GI tract on a day to day basis. And we desperately need that day to day iron to enter our bloodstream where our brains can pick it up. So it's great that you had a few weeks to a few months of relief but now your stores are high and you're probably not absorbing that much from food. Does this make any sense to you?

figflower

Re: Med trials/insomnia/depression

Post by figflower »

Hi Jimmy. Why not try the natural route BEFORE you stop the meds. That's what I would do. What about one day of green juice (or just eat the whole raw vegetable) fasting and see how you feel by evening? Then what about a second day??? Or what if you feel the RLS during the day or early evening and instead of taking the meds try any of a dozen instant cures. Just read AGAIN about a person who gets relief from a glass of tonic water called Schweppes Indian Tonic Water. I've never tried that but people swear by it. I have tried potassium in the form of cream of tartar and it works for about an hour or two but that's when I'm awake. Maybe if I went to sleep it would probably carry me through. I just read that turmeric, which some people swear by, is poorly absorbed by itself but if you combine it with pepper (piperone) or some type of fat it gets absorbed much better. I have never tried it but will one of these days. And of course you know my favorite - iron bis-glycinate on an empty stomach. The meds are always there for you so why not experiment when the RLS kicks in. JIf after 60 minutes you don't have relief you can always take your meds. Just think of how much easier weaning yourself off would be if you found something that works for you.

My husband has RLS, probably primary RLS, although I don't really believe there is a difference. Anyways, when he was young he would wrap rags around his legs to relieve the discomfort. His father told him it was growing pains. I told him it was restless legs syndrome. Like mine it is mild and intermittent, even more so than mine actually. My husband weighs about 130lbs. He's not much of an eater and only does so out of peer pressure. He doesn't smoke, drink or have any other medical conditions. He never takes any type of drug (ie aspirin for the rare headache) or coffee or tea or cola. And he's moderately active. He's a workaholic and may go an entire day and then realize he never stopped to eat. Still, a couple of times a year he lies in bed and does the Houdini thing and begs me to chop his legs off. I get out of bed and go to the kitchen to get a big knife. By the time I come back he's asleep. Lately, in his old age (50s) it's more frequent. It might be age or it might be the fact that he has an enlarged prostrate and will sometimes take the medication that his urologist wants him to or it might be that he had a large meal that night. The point is, I truly believe that he is basically RLS free (even though he is clearly pre-disposed) because he consistently under-eats and takes no drugs. I know one person does not a clinical trial make. And I never even made the connection until a few months ago when I read that fasting and/or consistently under-eating will increase the number and density of d2 receptors....in mice...and my husband :)

figflower

Re: Med trials/insomnia/depression

Post by figflower »

Good, easy to understand article: http://flipper.diff.org/app/items/4299

ViewsAskew
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Re: Med trials/insomnia/depression

Post by ViewsAskew »

Figflower wrote:Hi Viewsaskew, have you ever wondered why the iron infusions work for anywhere from a few weeks to a few months, but then poop out even though currently your iron stores are high. Naturally I have a theory :). I may have mentioned this to you at some point but I believe that the infused iron, be it over the course of a day or several days, only benefits our RLS brains while it is circulating in the bloodstream. And if it's the right kind of iron (different hospitals use different iron formulas) our brains suck it up. The iron increases the density (and maybe even the number!!!) of our dopamine receptors. I believe they become almost herculean in size compared to before the iron infusion. Then within a day or two after the infusion the iron is gone from the bloodstream in that it has been bound up within the red blood cells and liver and other organs. But not to worry, because you are now the proud owner of bigger, better receptors. Unfortunately, eventually the receptors shrink because our brains just can't seem to call enough up from our stores. This is all just my theory, but it's based on numerous articles that state our receptors need iron to be big and strong. I don't understand why doctors think there is some magical number that if only they could get our stores up to then we would be ok. Even Dr. B talks about John Hopkins and the fact that they got patients stores to 200 even 300 and in this way helped RLS patients??? I think that's the worst thing they can possibly do!!! The higher the stores the less likely iron will be absorbed from the GI tract on a day to day basis. And we desperately need that day to day iron to enter our bloodstream where our brains can pick it up. So it's great that you had a few weeks to a few months of relief but now your stores are high and you're probably not absorbing that much from food. Does this make any sense to you?


Figflower, they do not "poop out" as you are suggesting, from what I understand. It takes a certain level to be achieved and sustained, at least that is what the JH research appears to show. First infusion is dumped quickly. The second one sustains longer. Some people need two, some three or four.

Once that level is finally achieved, the patient stays symptom free for long periods. We don't know how long because they haven't done them for that many years. What Dr E is doing, I believe, is using that magic number to say, OK, when it gets here, we'll infuse again. JH jas done significant research on the type of iron and does know which seems to work best. It takes at least two weeks for the iron to make significant inroads to the brain. It doesn't get dumped in two days. You're assuming that some research about receptors applies to a whole system that is RLS. It doesn't occur in a vacuum and there are multiple other things going on. Might that be part of the puzzle? Maybe - but it's unlikely to be the whole one. It's just not logical.

In terms of absorbing iron, I know little. But, my gut says there is an error in your logic. And that is the statement above. Our bodies seem to work differently from other people's. We almost always have excellent hemoglobin. It's as if our bodies do not recognize that they need more iron, so they simply do not absorb it. Would the type of iron would change that? Possibly. But we don't know. If you think you are right, I'd suggest writing to JH and tell them your ideas and ask them to study it.

According to JH, here are some of the open issues:

"Gaps in our knowledge. Despite the substantial body of research on peripheral iron regulation, we still know very little about how iron is regulated by the blood-brain barrier or by the different cells within the brain. Also there is a relative lack of research on the effects of having iron insufficiency and on exactly how a brain region can be low in iron yet other organs in the body have normal levels?"
\

"Gaps in our knowledge. The mechanism by which iron influences dopamine function is still unclear. Iron deficiency affects other systems in the brain, which potentially could affect the dopamine systems. There is recent work done here at Johns Hopkins which suggests that another chemical in the brain, glutamate, may be equally important in causing some of the symptoms experienced by RLS patients. Brain cells in culture and brains from animals show similar changes in the dopamine activity when the iron levels are made to go low. Brain cells in culture and brains from animals are what is referred to as “models” of the disease. We can uses these models to examine the connections between iron and dopamine or glutamate, which could potential be used to understand what is happening in the human brain and specifically what is happening in RLS."

"Gaps in our Knowledge. The function of these genes in adult brain, let alone in RLS, remains unclear. The RLS-risk genes in relation to the primary iron management proteins may be upstream and may determine when and how iron is changed. Alternatively, RLS susceptibility genes may be downstream from the iron changes and thus may act to modify the consequences of the changes in iron. The more important question is: how does the cell metabolism-iron management proteins relation change or the iron-dopamine relation change when these RLS-risk genes are varied?
Ann - Take what you need, leave the rest

Managing Your RLS

Opinions presented by Discussion Board Moderators are personal in nature and do not, in any way, represent the opinion of the RLS Foundation, and are not medical advice.

figflower

Re: Med trials/insomnia/depression

Post by figflower »

What happened with you? Did it take two weeks before you noticed a lessening of symptoms or did you feel a lessening that night? Like I said, Dr. B stated that people walked out of the hospital and threw their drugs away and never looked back. Until the RLS came crawling back into their lives. Then it was time for another infusion. And like I said, I'd bet dollars to donuts, that those who literally stopped all medication, had longer relief.

We have shoddy dopamine receptors because of low brain iron according to autopsies and PET scans. And I for one believe it. We know that the dopamine agonists squeeze the dopamine out of those bad receptors, damaging them even more in the process. But not irreversibly. Iron is not a dopamine agonist. Not that I've ever heard. My understanding is that iron (that reaches the brain) makes the receptors robust. Robust receptors don't need DAs. So, ipso facto, I assume the iron infusions make our receptors robust, on a very large scale. And even if your iron levels remain high after the infusion, as yours did the second time, eventually, the receptors retreat. Based on what I know now, if I were to get an infusion and get relief, I would do every thing in my power to maintain those receptors. No DAs, no opiates, maybe intermittent fasting and/or anaerobic exercise. If the RLS did come creeping back, despite my best efforts, then I would take that best form of iron (that the hospital came up with) and see if it's available in a pill form and take it orally, on an empty stomach.

There's just something to iron that works...as long as the iron gets into your bloodstream and then your brain. If our brains could call the iron up from our stores then we wouldn't have RLS. But for argument sake, let's say our brains CAN call the iron up from our stores, but our brains lack a protein or an enzyme to convert or transport that iron (now within the brain) to our receptors, then the iron infusions wouldn't work either if a protein in the brain is lacking!!!! But the infusions do work so obviously our brains have all the chemicals and structures it needs to get that iron to our receptors. There's no magic number (200, 224, 333, 666???) to our bodily iron stores that is all of a sudden going to allow our brains to call it up.

With that said, I think that iron is the lesser of the evil choices we have to treat our RLS. I hate every time I have to take an iron pill. I have my theories...as you know. I think our RLS brains are perfectly able to call iron up from our stores if our livers would let it. I think the malfunction lies with an over-reactive liver that produces a hormone called hepcidin. Hepcidin is the iron gatekeeper. Our liver releases it every time it senses that our bodies are under attack and withholds the release of iron from our stores and from our guts into the blood stream. For most people attack means infections and cancer. But maybe with us RLSers, hepcidin gets released when we come into contact with allergens, or inflammation from arthritis, or maybe a raucous gut microbiome. I think we just have a really over-zealous gatekeeper. As a matter of fact, even that minor inflammation that occurs from an aggressive work-out might be enough to call forth the hepcidin and the withholding of iron. So add that withholding of iron, plus a normal drop in iron in late evening and you have full-blown RLS, just because you decided to jog a few miles. The worse the inflammation or infection, the more hepcidin is released and the less iron that is released, I believe for everyone. Anyways, I think my brain is able to call just enough iron up to keep my receptors healthy enough to release just enough dopamine to quiet my legs when I lie down. But if I take anything that interferes with that iron or those receptors such as benedryl or Tagamet, watch out. Then it's time for an iron pill. But then I'm just working against Mother Nature. So what if I do have too much of a pathogen in my gut and it's to my benefit for my body to withhold iron to keep it in check (pathogens love and need iron). By taking that lousy iron pill I'm giving myself some rest but I'm also feeding the pathogen. And supposedly I do have an overgrowth of a pathogen, called candida albicans and I hate candida and I am loathe to give it anything but Nystatin - an anti-fungal.

ViewsAskew
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Re: Med trials/insomnia/depression

Post by ViewsAskew »

I've always been told not to expect anything for at least two weeks and that it could take upwards of 6-8 weeks. It took 2-3 weeks both times for me.

I wish you well with your choices. I hope you wish everyone who chooses to do things differently from you the same.
Ann - Take what you need, leave the rest

Managing Your RLS

Opinions presented by Discussion Board Moderators are personal in nature and do not, in any way, represent the opinion of the RLS Foundation, and are not medical advice.

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