RLS; Now Stable

Use this section to discuss your experiences with prescription drugs, iron injections, and other medical interventions that involve the introduction of a drug or medicine into the body. Discuss side effects, successes, failures, published research, information about drug trials, and information about new medications being developed.

Important: Posts and information in this section are based on personal experiences and recommendations; they should not be considered a substitute for the advice of a healthcare provider.
badnights
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Re: RLS; Now Stable

Postby badnights » Fri Mar 10, 2017 4:50 am

Maybe the problem is not that the meds are wearing off, maybe it's the meds making the RLS worse: it starts earlier in the day, it's more intense. That would be augmentation. Has it spread to your arms yet?
Beth - Wishing you all restful sleep tonight
WED/RLS AUGMENTATION:
viewtopic.php?f=5&t=6532&p=61601#p61601
Discussion Board Moderator's posts don't reflect the RLS Foundation's opinion & are not medical advice

IThinkImInTorture
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Re: RLS; Now Stable

Postby IThinkImInTorture » Fri Mar 10, 2017 2:12 pm

i did notice mild sensation in my arms yes.

SLEEPY ANGEL
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Re: RLS; Now Stable

Postby SLEEPY ANGEL » Fri Mar 10, 2017 3:22 pm

IThinkImInTorture---

It sounds to me hat you are experiencing Augmentation, rather similar to what I have been experiencing. I have to keep busy and on my feet as late afternoon is upon me; if I'm lazy and sitting on the couch, the symptoms will hit by 5 PM. So I start taking small bits of my Requip at 5:30 as well as Gabapentin. The problem seems to be that my Meds wear off & are not effective when 4 AM rolls around. I also can see that my lower arms and hands are getting more & more "into the picture"... and their antsy movements bother me now (when a month ago it wasn't so).

IThinkImInTorture
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Re: RLS; Now Stable

Postby IThinkImInTorture » Fri Mar 10, 2017 3:31 pm

The Ultram effectively treats my RLS symptoms. The Neupro is a nice addition as it counters the drowsy dopey feeling the ultram creates. I just watched a video from some .au doctor that states treating augmentation is done by switching to an opiod like ultram, weaning off the dopamine antagonist for a year or so then going back if really necessary. What kind of science is that? My neurologist is trying to get me onto dopamine antagonists to get me off opiod medication.

I just saw www.myrelaxis.com, a vibrating pad for $700 that has high praise for treating RLS symptoms. Does anybody use it? Is it a gimmick?

Rustsmith
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Re: RLS; Now Stable

Postby Rustsmith » Fri Mar 10, 2017 4:04 pm

IThinkImInTorture, the Australian video that you watched described the more humane of the two procedures that are used to get someone off of dopamine agonists (note that it is agonist, not antagonist. Agonists are sort of like dopamine look alikes where antagonists oppose the dopamine). The other procedure used to get people off of DA meds is to go cold turkey, which is very difficult and results in almost no sleep for a week to 10 days.

My guess is that since your doctor wants to get you off of the opioid meds because of pressure that is being placed on doctors by the government to avoid the use of these medications. But for those of us who have experienced augmentation on the DAs, the use of opioid meds and avoidance of DAs is the typical next step in treatment.

As for the Relaxis device, no it is not a gimmick. It is still new, so there isn't a lot of experience with it. Here is a discussion thread reporting on one of our member's experience with the device. http://bb.rls.org/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=9861&hilit=relaxis
Steve

Augmentation Evaluation http://bb.rls.org/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=9005

Opinions presented by Discussion Board Moderators are personal in nature and do not, in any way, represent the opinion of the RLS Foundation, and are not medical advice.

badnights
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Re: RLS; Now Stable

Postby badnights » Sun Mar 12, 2017 6:35 am

intorture, it does sound like you might be augmented. Augmentation is not really a case of the drug losing effectiveness, it's a case of the drug actually making the disease worse. It only happens with the DAs (Neupro, Mirapex, Requip) and very rarely with Ultram.

It can only be treated by completely removing DAs from your system for a period of time, so the Aussie doctor was bang on. As Steve said, some doctors say you have to go cold turkey; others concede that an opioid is needed to get over the withdrawal.

Then what happens once you're off the DA and the withdrawal is over? You need something to treat your symptoms. Some doctors think you can go back on a DA. The dose will be lower since your symptoms will have improved (possibly as good as pre-DA). But it seems that many (most?) people who go back on a DA will augment again. The long-term solution then is usually an opioid; sometimes an opioid combined with an anti-convulsant, or an opioid alternating with a DA.

If your doctor does not know any of this, you can ask him to please find out about it. Maybe ask if he can tell you - this visit or next - whatever he can find out about augmentation and how to treat it. Simply ask him that.

If he doesn't seem to want to learn about it, ask if he can refer you to someone who knows about augmentation and how to treat it. If he can't, get another doctor without further delay. Maybe start looking now, before you give your current doctor his last chance.
Beth - Wishing you all restful sleep tonight
WED/RLS AUGMENTATION:
viewtopic.php?f=5&t=6532&p=61601#p61601
Discussion Board Moderator's posts don't reflect the RLS Foundation's opinion & are not medical advice

IThinkImInTorture
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Joined: Thu Feb 05, 2015 2:53 pm

Re: RLS; Now Stable

Postby IThinkImInTorture » Sun Mar 12, 2017 12:00 pm

Good point, was thinking the same thing. This guy has a wall full of accolades from best doctors in the Washingtonian and peer review at Georgetown but he doesnt know about augmentation. I think the DA actually lists a reaction with SSRIs like Cymbalta I take. He commited to the DA but seemed uneasy giving me the RX almost like his ego didnt want to change its mind and be embarrassed prescribing it and having the patient find the contraindications instead if him.

ViewsAskew
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Re: RLS; Now Stable

Postby ViewsAskew » Sun Mar 12, 2017 4:41 pm

yeah, I went to a doctor like him...ruined my life as far as I am concerned. Arrogant @!%*&@#3!*
Ann - Take what you need, leave the rest

Managing Your RLS

Opinions presented by Discussion Board Moderators are personal in nature and do not, in any way, represent the opinion of the RLS Foundation, and are not medical advice.

badnights
Moderator
Posts: 4492
Joined: Tue Mar 10, 2009 4:20 pm
Location: Northwest Territories, Canada

Re: RLS; Now Stable

Postby badnights » Mon Mar 13, 2017 6:19 am

It's so much easier to work with a doctor who has no ego issues! One who's secure enough to be comfortable even when a patient realizes the doctor doesn't know everything.
Beth - Wishing you all restful sleep tonight
WED/RLS AUGMENTATION:
viewtopic.php?f=5&t=6532&p=61601#p61601
Discussion Board Moderator's posts don't reflect the RLS Foundation's opinion & are not medical advice


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