RLS/PLMS related to fight/flight reflex?

[Kimberly]

I looked for a discussion about this a could not find one. I am interested in learning if others may be feeling that their RLS or PLMS is connected somehow to a glitch in their 'flight' response? I've long wondered why folks with Tourettes and Parkinsons can have movement throughout the day that seems to shut off at night, while those of us with RLS/PLMS have just the opposite. And what exactly is it about any attempt by my body to rest/sleep day or night that causes the onset of movement. Am wondering if there is a faulty switch in the brain that when the body attempts to rest/relax/sleep it automatically triggers a fight/flight reflex? I spend between 6 and 8 hours EVERY night trying to sleep and immediately 'jumping' out of my skin....repeatedly, unless I occupy my mind and move. I keep going back to bed and trying again, but I fail to be able to sleep until almost 7am when I think I am just passing out from sheer exhaustion. I've tried many meds, am currently only using xanax, but am not sure how any of the meds typically prescribed for RLS/PLMW would have any affect on fight/flight reflex?
I'd like to hear your thoughts on this.

[Betty/WV]

Kimberly: I do remember reading something about this, somewhere. But don't remember where or any details. I read so much that it is hard to keep it all organized in my brain. It is an interesting theory.

I relate to what you said about not being able to go to sleep until early morning. I used to say that I went to sleep "when the birds sang." Because I would usually go to sleep around 5:30 am and that was when I would hear the birds start to chirp. It was so odd because it would be as if someone turned a switch off and I would relax and go to sleep. Just like turning off a light switch.



If I remember anything about the "fight or flight" theory I'll let you know.

BETTY/WV

[Polar Bear]

This is very interesting cos my best time for sleep would be 5am - 9 am.

[badnights]

I read an article a long time ago, or maybe just the abstract, and I'm dismayed I can't find it again. Some researchers decided to check if RLSers have a heightened auditory startle reflex, because (this is the part I forget) other people with damage to the substantia nigra do (RLS is thought, for other reasons, to involve screw-ups in the substantia nigra, which is part of the brain), and we do. That means we're more likely to jump or even cry out (to startle) at unexpected, sudden noises.

Not what you're looking for, but in the same forest.

[SquirmingSusan]

I've read that same article, Beth, about the heightened startle reflex. And it's very true for me, and my kids used to entertain themselves by startling me and watching me jump. Fortunately they seem to have forgotten about that.

I don't know about the fight or flight thing, but I have a friend who is a therapist and she's always telling me that there's something wrong in my psyche that my legs don't want to stop moving. Like my body is trying to tell me something. I hate that; it's just another way to blame the victim to me. But she does it with all conditions and to everyone, including herself with her own various medical issues.

We are much more likely to have issues with anxiety and depression, so maybe those tendencies tie in to the fight or flight thing.

[Polar Bear]

I can relate to the heightened startle reflex.

[Kimberly]

..... I hate that; it's just another way to blame the victim to me.".

Aghhhh! I hate that too! pfft...psyche my legs. Sure....we ALL just happen to have some SAME psychological issue that affect us ALL with RLS!

I will buy the idea though that it could be some kind of misfiring. Like I said, every time my brain gets even a clue that I want to make my body sleep...it makes my body move.

I'm going to keep working on making a weighted blanket and see if I can't 'trick' my brain into keeping my body still

[Andreadrea]

I have always had an extremely strong startle response, and have often had hyper-reflexes. This was before the RLS started.

[fraujoolie]

I've also got a high startle reflex, part of having PTSD. I'm not sure if it's connected to the RLS, though. Both my father and maternal grandfather had RLS, too.
My startle reflex has been around forever, while the RLS developed later in life, after a back injury.... so, I'm more likely to say that the nerve damage in my spine had something to do with it (along with genetic factors).

Right now, I'm totally undermedicated. I jitter the worst from 9pm-3am, but I still have the tremors in the morning when I'm waking up. They start back up again around 11am, and slowly ramp up from there. I suppose my golden hour of sleep would be around 9-11am. How well does that work for anyone?

[sleepdancer]

As far as timing, it seems I too get my best sleep as daybreak approaches. don't know if that's because of probable increased REM or why.

[ViewsAskew]

Speaking of flight and startle response...what about tickle response or other heightened skin sensation? This has always been a hallmark of my RLS - and of everyone in my family.

That makes me wonder if we just aren't overreacting to certain stimuli in general for some reason...that would also fit with generalized anxiety.

[badnights]

I've always been super-ticklish. And easily startled. Makes you wonder, ya.

My startle reflex has been around forever, while the RLS developed later in life, after a back injury.... so, I'm more likely to say that the nerve damage in my spine had something to do with it (along with genetic factors).

It's very common for RLS to flare up or initiate after an operation, but no one knows why. Nerves affected somehow? Pain killers set something off? No one knows. Yet.

[ViewsAskew]

In the beginning of RLS-dom, I controlled it with lotion. If I was at ALL dry, my RLS would go nuts. I still lotion up completely twice a day.

I've heard many of us here say that we cannot tolerate being touched by anyone when the RLS is present. Mine's been very bad the last week without my regular meds and I've had to be quite mean to hubby and withhold hugs or any affection. Tonight on the couch he asked if he could touch me. How sad.

But, back to the issue at hand. This does all seem related in some way.

[badnights]

ouch !
Is that because that new doc withheld the methadone? May she rot in hell (as my mother used to say... I thought things burned in hell)

[ViewsAskew]

ouch !
Is that because that new doc withheld the methadone? May she rot in hell (as my mother used to say... I thought things burned in hell)

I had to wait a week to see her and I'm the one who put off making the appt until it was too late. Then she compounded it by not writing. So, I'm using the hydromorphone that makes me about suidicidal - depressed, sad, and with blazing headaches that last for a couple weeks after I stop taking it. And on top of that it doesn't cover the RLS completely so I get 1-3 hours of sleep. Guess that's better than none...