Morning Sickness

For everything and anything else not covered in the other RLS sections.
mack
Posts: 19
Joined: Tue Feb 04, 2020 7:11 pm

Morning Sickness

Post by mack »

For several years, I get sick in the morning. Every morning, to some varying degree. Nausea, sometimes stomach/intestinal problems, occasional light-headed. But always nausea. And this is the kicker: The better I sleep, the worse the sickness.

I am on 10 mg of Methadone (1x daily), but I don't think its related to that. The illness clears up by around midday, hours before I take my Methadone.

Since the sickness is related to how well I sleep, I thought maybe its RLS-connected. I've never met a doctor who had a clue about this.

I'm reasonably certain that I'm not pregnant, since I am an old retired guy!

Has anyone here experienced this, or heard of it? Thanking you in advance.

ps-This is my first post, so let me know if I've put this in the wrong category. Thanks again.

Rustsmith
Moderator
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Location: Colorado Springs, Colorado

Re: Morning Sickness

Post by Rustsmith »

mack, welcome to the discussion board.

Your message is in the right category since the nausea is probably not tied to your methadone.

Personally, that is not something that I experience so I cannot provide you with any comments. Is this something that you have discussed with your doctor? If it is a symptom of something else and is related to being in bed, it might be important to find out what and get it treated. I could see how sleeping soundly might be related to not moving around, which could be associated with some sort of stomach problem. But I am absolutely not qualified to provide any advice about that and am totally guessing.
Steve

https://www.mayoclinicproceedings.org/a ... 0/fulltext
Opinions presented by Discussion Board Moderators are personal in nature and do not, in any way, represent the opinion of the RLS Foundation, and are not medical advice.

mack
Posts: 19
Joined: Tue Feb 04, 2020 7:11 pm

Re: Morning Sickness

Post by mack »

Steve,

Thanks for your thoughts on this.

Yes, I've discussed with various doctors, specialists and GP's. I'm not real concerned about it. Its a pain, but I've learned to live with it. I was more curious about whether anybody else had this particularly problem. Thought it might shed some light on it. Thanks again.

ViewsAskew
Moderator
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Joined: Thu Oct 28, 2004 6:37 am
Location: Los Angeles

Re: Morning Sickness

Post by ViewsAskew »

Huh. That definitely must be uncomfortable - the only time I am nauseous in the morning is if I take a vitamin on an empty stomach or if ate right before bed (I wake up nauseously hungry). I rarely eat before I go to sleep as that is icky. Neither of my situations are close to yours.

Welcome, mack. Glad to have you here.
Ann - Take what you need, leave the rest

Managing Your RLS

Opinions presented by Discussion Board Moderators are personal in nature and do not, in any way, represent the opinion of the RLS Foundation, and are not medical advice.

mack
Posts: 19
Joined: Tue Feb 04, 2020 7:11 pm

Re: Morning Sickness

Post by mack »

Ann,

"nauseously hungry".... Good description. I get that sometimes, when the nausea is mild. But when its bad, I can't eat, think, or anything else. On the positive side, I don't have to watch my weight.

Eating before bed ... You're right, its not a good idea. But it doesn't seem to be the cause of my sickness. It might sometimes make it worse. Its something to keep in mind. Thank you kindly.

ViewsAskew
Moderator
Posts: 16570
Joined: Thu Oct 28, 2004 6:37 am
Location: Los Angeles

Re: Morning Sickness

Post by ViewsAskew »

Wish I had some ideas.
Ann - Take what you need, leave the rest

Managing Your RLS

Opinions presented by Discussion Board Moderators are personal in nature and do not, in any way, represent the opinion of the RLS Foundation, and are not medical advice.

debbluebird
Posts: 2386
Joined: Mon May 21, 2012 3:27 pm

Re: Morning Sickness

Post by debbluebird »

I'd say it is related to what you are eating, either the dinner meal or if you eat before bed. If I eat carbs, bread, anything with flour, anything with sugar, or if it turns to sugar, I have stomach problems.

mack
Posts: 19
Joined: Tue Feb 04, 2020 7:11 pm

Re: Morning Sickness

Post by mack »

Deb,

Thank you for the suggestion. I didn't know about carbs, flour, etc. A couple of questions about it...

- The one cause/effect that I'm certain of is: Amount of sleep vs. degree of sickness. That is, the less I sleep, the less sick I get. And conversely, more sleep, more sickness. Could that tie into diet somehow?

- Would the carbs/bread angle cause dizziness (or light-headedness)?

Even if diet is not the cause, I will try cutting out flour-type foods. It might at least lessen the symptoms.

Thanks again for your help.


ps-I don't think eating before bed is much of a factor, because I usually don't, and I'm just as sick.

stjohnh
Posts: 1284
Joined: Sun Feb 14, 2016 3:13 pm
Location: Palo Alto, California

Re: Morning Sickness

Post by stjohnh »

Mack, early morning nausea, every day for several years, is a very unusual symptom. Assuming it has not worsened, the good news is it is not likely any of the several kinds of cancer that can cause nausea. Nausea can be caused by lots of different brain, stomach, intestinal and other problems. The likelihood that it is circadian rhythm related increases the possibility that it may be iron mediated. I found several mild "problems" that either got obviously better or worse after my iron infusions.
Blessings,
Holland

mack
Posts: 19
Joined: Tue Feb 04, 2020 7:11 pm

Re: Morning Sickness

Post by mack »

Holland,
Thank you for your reply. Wow, the folks on this forum really know their stuff!

I have had my iron level checked at intervals over the last 15 years, because of the relationship between iron deficiency and RLS. However, my iron level is always found to be normal. Could there still be a link between iron level and nausea? ...I mean, even in cases where iron level was "normal"?

Thanks again.

stjohnh
Posts: 1284
Joined: Sun Feb 14, 2016 3:13 pm
Location: Palo Alto, California

Re: Morning Sickness

Post by stjohnh »

Mack,
Iron is required for all life, including plants, one cell organisms, and of course us humans (I'm assuming you are human, if not I apologize, LOL). The amount of iron needed varies from organ to organ. Unfortunately most doctors only know that iron is needed for blood formation, thus the common response from doctors that "if you are not anemic, then you don't need iron." This is completely wrong. Most people with RLS have iron levels in their blood that most doctors (poorly educated about iron) consider normal. The only way to know if you need IV iron is to get the numerical results (not just "normal") for the following tests: ferritin, iron panel, transferrin. When you get the numbers for those tests, you can then compare with the guidelines to see if you are a suitable candidate.

RLS is caused by BID (Brain Iron Deficiency). Many people with RLS can have their symptoms markedly reduced or even eliminated with IV Iron treatments. This is the only treatment that gets at the basis for RLS (low brain iron). It has almost no side effects. The International Restless Legs Syndrome Study Group has elevated IV Iron treatment to first line therapy. This means that IV Iron is one of the first treatments doctors should try, not one of the last (as has been done for many years). If you can get your doc to prescribe IV Iron treatment, that is the way you should go. Unfortunately this is fairly new information and most docs, even those that frequently treat RLS, are not aware of it. Note that the blood test doctors usually do to check for low iron (ferritin test) only checks for low BLOOD iron, there is no test available for checking for low BRAIN iron. Oral iron usually doesn't provide a high enough blood level increase to help, folks need IV Iron infusions. Here is a link to the recommendations:
https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/a ... via%3Dihub
Blessings,
Holland

Frunobulax
Posts: 430
Joined: Mon Jun 02, 2014 7:41 pm

Re: Morning Sickness

Post by Frunobulax »

mack wrote: - The one cause/effect that I'm certain of is: Amount of sleep vs. degree of sickness. That is, the less I sleep, the less sick I get. And conversely, more sleep, more sickness. Could that tie into diet somehow?
There are a couple of things related to this. We sometimes have higher glucose in the morning (dawn effect), we switch the production of some hormones (melatonin is only produced in the evening and during sleep I think), we might see higher cortisol levels. This may or may not be related to restless legs and/or your diet, impossible to tell without more information.

I do have some nausea-like symptoms sometimes at the end of my fast. I do intermittent fasting, often with only one meal a day (or rather a 2-hour eating window), and on those days I feel occasionally fairly weird which could be described as nausea and appears to be a lack of energy. It happens rarely (maybe one day out of 10 or less) so if it happens I'll just eat something or simply have some bulletproof coffee, a coffee with butter and coconut oil, and the nausea will be gone after an hour or so. (Please note that I'm on a ketogenic diet -- as discussed here http://bb.rls.org/viewtopic.php?f=20&t=10588, virtually no carbs -- and I wouldn't recommend a bulletproof coffee unless you eat some form of low carb.)

To see if it's diet related, a few questions: Does the sickness respond to food, that is, will it clear up even if you don't have breakfast? And is there any relation to what and when you ate in the evening? Did you check for metabolic syndrome, diabetes or prediabetes (ideally via Kraft patterns)? What's your HbA1C blood value?

It might be an hormonal/neurotransmitter issue and not diet related. We do seem to have some abnormalities there -- the RLS/BID connection is a hypothesis, and I always caution to keep in mind that it may be something else (possibly for some minority of us RLS sufferers), but it seems very, very likely that we have some issues with neurotransmitter production in our brain. We know that hormonal changes can cause morning nausea for pregnant women...

mack
Posts: 19
Joined: Tue Feb 04, 2020 7:11 pm

Re: Morning Sickness

Post by mack »

Frunobulax,

No, the sickness does not respond to food. It remains the same whether I eat anything or not.

Something I forgot to mention. Maybe this is important. In the morning, after I'm up and around, if I sit down and doze off a little, I get much sicker. But, I can doze off later in the day, and it has no bad effect.

Much thanks.

mack
Posts: 19
Joined: Tue Feb 04, 2020 7:11 pm

Re: Morning Sickness

Post by mack »

Holland,

Your info is very new to me. It'll take me a little time to digest it all. Thank you kindly.

Frunobulax
Posts: 430
Joined: Mon Jun 02, 2014 7:41 pm

Re: Morning Sickness

Post by Frunobulax »

mack wrote:Frunobulax,

No, the sickness does not respond to food. It remains the same whether I eat anything or not.

Something I forgot to mention. Maybe this is important. In the morning, after I'm up and around, if I sit down and doze off a little, I get much sicker. But, I can doze off later in the day, and it has no bad effect.
I'm not a doctor, but it sounds to me as if neither diet nor RLS are the primary cause. Maybe an endocrinology checkup would shed some light on this? Sounds to me as this may be cortisol (stress hormone) related. Also make sure to have your thyroid checked.

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